Exif question

[cgbraggjr]

I use Lightroom for editing and tried a test image with *all* the Exif, IPTC etc. fields filled in, and yet when I set PTE project options to "JPEG Exif Comment" and set it for all existing slides, nothing came up when I previewed the slide. The "JPEG Exif Description" works just fine and in Lightroom this field is the Caption field. So, where can I find the Comment field and display it in PTE?

Thanks in advance....

[Lin Evans]

I believe that's one of the bugs yet to be worked out. Igor is looking into the problem.

Best regards,

Lin

I use Lightroom for editing and tried a test image with *all* the Exif, IPTC etc. fields filled in, and yet when I set PTE project options to "JPEG Exif Comment" and set it for all existing slides, nothing came up when I previewed the slide. The "JPEG Exif Description" works just fine and in Lightroom this field is the Caption field. So, where can I find the Comment field and display it in PTE?

Thanks in advance....

[Conflow]

Argonaut,

The 'Exif Data' is encoded and stored within the Image itself, provided of

course the Camera put it there in the first place. If 'Exif' was switched-off

then no data will be available. Programs which record or extract Exif-Data

use a specially written 'Codec' designed for that purpose.

I am not aware that such a Codec is used in PTE or whether PTE would

support an 'imported' Codec, I suggest you EMail Igor about that...

Brian.Conflow.

[cgbraggjr]

Conflow - the Caption field was filled in with Lightroom, and that field shows up in PTE, so I don't think there is a translation problem between LR and PTE. I've seen postings about bugs, so I guess that's the problem.

[Conflow]

Argonout,

I think you might have missed my point...

I said..I am not aware that such a Codec is used in PTE or whether PTE would

support an 'imported' Codec, I suggest you EMail Igor about that...

If a 'Codec' is installed in PTE.5xx I would imagine that this would give Igor some

problems because you have to content with Pan & Zooming of images ~ meaning

that we are not dealing with 'static-images' ~ consequently extracting the Exif

Data is going to be difficult....Thats the reason I suggested you should EMail Igor

to get an update on that aspect of the PTE Program.

Regards,

Brian.Conflow.

[sanewcomb]

The problem isn't with P2E. Adobe has a long history of messing up headers in the JPEG file format. In addition, the names of the fields are often confused by developers and given different names.

So what you think the JPEG Exif Comment field is in Adobe Products is often a different field all together. I don't have your product so I can't give you specific instructions.

You can check to see if your Adobe product is filling in the actual field with the program Exifer.

http://www.exifer.friedemann.info/

Select the thumbnail, press Ctrl-E, and select the EXIF data tab. The text string should appear in the Comment box at the bottom. I will guess it will not be there. You can look through the other data fields and formats to see if you can find it.

This program can be used to edit the Exif data fields of image files and does it correctly. Adobe is probably filling in a field of it's own header specification, or a related spec such as IPTC.

Steve Newcomb

Tucson, AZ USA

[alrobin]

Lightroom doesn't display the "comment" EXIF field. It doesn't even include in the list of possible data to view for one's images. (see second and third images below).

However, it does recognize it and will include it if you request an ".xmp" file. (see first image below).

I verified this by creating a comment right in the camera's "Menu", and looking for it in Lightroom and the information page in IrfanView as well as "Exifer" (see attached 4th and 5th images).

And, PTE picks it up just fine, as expected, as an EXIF "comment" (see last example).

[cgbraggjr]

Al, let me be sure I understand you. You created a comment using your *camera*, and when you looked at the photo in Lightroom, setting Lightroom so that metadata is saved to an XMP file, the comment was there. I hope that's right. But, if LR can't edit the field, then it's no good for my purpose. There's no way I can use the camera as an input/editing device for Exif data. (I think I must have missed something in your message.)

A.

[alrobin]

Al, let me be sure I understand you. You created a comment using your *camera*, and when you looked at the photo in Lightroom, setting Lightroom so that metadata is saved to an XMP file, the comment was there.

That's correct - I could not find any way to edit that comment in Lightroom. But Lightroom knows that it is there because it saved it in the "xmp" file. Maybe you could edit it in the "xmp" file, as it appears to be just a text file. It's purpose is to transfer metadata from one application to another, particularly in the case of proprietary "raw" images. But I don't see how you would re-associate that data with a jpeg image, itself.

[mhwarner]

I think the bottom line here is that EXIF comments, no matter what application they were created or entered with, do not yet work in PtoE. Things like the file name, date, time, and maybe some other fields do, but comments and descriptions do not yet work. I have tried it in beta 10 and still could not see them (but then, I see no mention in the fix list that this item has yet been resolved either). I tried adding them in both Exifer and Thumbs Plus and can see them in both programs (the ones added in the other program). Check the postings below for additional info. Some of them are as recent as October and November, so I don't think there has been any resolution yet. (My personal preference would be to read IPTC information, which I think is more universal, but maybe Igor can't do that easily.)

http://www.picturestoexe.com/forums/index....ost&p=47703

http://www.picturestoexe.com/forums/index....ost&p=46295

http://www.picturestoexe.com/forums/index....ost&p=43952

[alrobin]

Mary,

I beg to differ - "EXIF comments" do show up in PTE - I just proved that in the examples in my post above. However, some of the other EXIF fields and all of the IPTC fields cannot be shown in PTE as Igor has not added a capability to display them yet. Personally, I am more interested in the EXIF fields than the IPTC fields, but both would be nice to have.

[sanewcomb]

Mary,

I agree with Al that the JPEG EXIF Comments work in P2E. However, there could be some sort of bug on some machines. Could you explain what you are doing to see if others can identify a different reason for not seeing them?

After putting them in the JPEG image file you'll need to go into Project Options, Comments Tab and press the Insert Template link towards the bottom. Select JPEG EXIF Comments option. This will place comments on new slides that are added to the show. Press the Set for Existing Slides button next to the template link to add them to existing slides.

Another possibility is the Offset paramenter on that page may be set to a too high number moving the comment totally off the screen and work area.

You can also confirm you've done all this work by opening up the O&A window of the slide with a comment and you should see a second object entry labeled "Text comment" in the objects list. If it isn't there, then something wasn't pressed right (or there is a really odd bug, but I'll place my bet on the former).

Steve Newcomb

Tucson, AZ USA

[Conflow]

Hi All,

I had intended not to 're-post' to this thread but having seen Al Robinsons 'Test-Work' in

coming to conclusions about Exif Data and the Adode LightRoom problem I have to say that

I agree with Al and fully support his conclusions.

I joined the Forum 3 years ago and at that time I posted Data and Links to an 'Exif Utility'

which had just been developed and which I have used extensively....So lets get the facts:-

LightRoom

Was never designed to handle Exif Data ~ it was designed by Adode to imbed 'Meta-Data'

into Documents and Tiff Images as XMP Files ~ their name for MetaData.

Exif Utility

Designed in 1998 by the JEITA Organisation (Japan Electronics & Information Tech Assoc)

where by Camera Makers would have a 'cross-platform' of exchangable data common to

the Camera Makers and Process Laboratories and Geo-Physicist's and GPS Utilities, yes it

does handle GPS. The Format is JPeg ~ The 'MetaData' is an EMI File. (sometimes emi)

Argonauts Problem

Lightroom see's some 'metadata' in the JPeg Images and 'mistakenly' thinks its an XMP File

of its own genisis, and to quote Bill Newcomb...Adobe has a long history of messing up...

The Exif Format

Exif offers 256 Data Fields comprising:-16 Generic Camera Makes with 56 Comments and

Thumbnails with 20 ~Make Notes 80 ~GPS 31 ~IPTC 36 and a few Header comments.

What goes Wrong

Exif Data has strong inbuilt 'Anti-Tamper Security' ~ if you alter or in any way change the

origional Image the Exif Data is lost (for Legal reasons).If you wish to preserve the modified

data you must first save the origional data as an EMI File (emi) then complete any Editing

and then re-import the saved data to the Modified Image.

The same applies to any Image and also those with Pan & Zoom ~ therin lies the "crunch"

which Igor is working on.

Examples are shown below:-

Image1. Size 1280x960 pix. plus Exif Data.

Image2. Resized to 1024x768 pix. No Exif Data. (Image modified)

Image3. Corrected for 1024x768 size with 'reinserted' Exif Data.

Image4. Example of MetaData EMI File within the Image.

Also below are 'Snapshots' of 2 Programs which handle Exif Data ~ I recommend "Exifier"

designed by a brilliant Engineer ~ Friedemann Schmidt.

"Link" to the Exifer Site:- (Click-on the Web Photo for more Screens)

http://www.exifer.friedemann.info/index.htm

Hope this helps the problems...

Brian.Conflow.

[mhwarner]

OK, I stand corrected (somewhat) but here's the problem as far as I can tell. And I believe Lin made reference to this somewhere in another post. The bottom line is that there is no consistency.

There are actually 2 "Comments" fields for JPEG files. There is one that is commonly referred to as "JPEG Comments" -- which is the one that is typically written into the file by a large majority of thumbnail editors/image management programs, and there is another called "User Comments" which is actually part of the EXIF spec. Very few mainstream image management applications appear to write to this field. Not Adobe Bridge, not Irvfanview, not ThumbsPlus (I don't have time to do an audit of ACDsee and some of the others). Then there is also the "Description" field that is part of the EXIF spec. Again, apparently not used by the majority of mainstream applications. Exifer (which is not, as far as I can tell, one of the mainstream, typical applications that is used by the vast majority of people to manage their images), does in fact write to both of these fields (but doing so is a chore and not easily accomplished -- I'm sure there is help somewhere, but I didn't find it in the application). It can also read and write the typical "Comment" field written to by most of these other standard applications -- but it does so on a separate tab entitled "JPEG Comment". If you use this field, which again is the one that is most commonly written to by the vast majority of image management applications (and the most easily accessible field), it doesn't show up in P2E.

FYI: If you use Exifer to write something in the description field, it will in fact show up in Adobe Bridge under the IPTC Core fields as "Description" and in ThumbsPlus, as well as IrfanView under the IPTC "Caption" field. However, writing data into either of these fields from other applications DOES NOT make it show up in the "Description" field in Exifer, nor does it show up in P2E. This (mostly) uneditable Description field shows up in IrfanView EXIF information as "Image Description", but again, it is not editable.

So this is my reason for suggesting that it might make more sense to use IPTC information, if it is possible to get the information easily (and it can't be that difficult since it seems that most image management programs can do it). As far as I can tell, most, if not all, image management programs have the ability to read and write IPTC data directly into the file without using "sidecar" files (which by the way is a universal standard for news exchange that is used by virtually every major news organization in the world). I am not saying that we shouldn't still have the ability to use EXIF for file name, date and time and camera-related data, but as far as doing "automatic" captioning of slides and slideshows with textual information, I believe that IPTC would be a far better choice. My 2 cents.

[sanewcomb]

Mary,

You seemed to be a little perplexed by this whole comment issue with JPEG files, but don't worry. It confuses a lot of people. It isn't a well defined or well standardized part of the JPEG specification. Not sure the history behind it, but somewhere in the JPEG format development I suspect they felt it useful to leave space in the file structure/specification for others to freely utilize. What's wrong with freedom, Good for all, right? It does give the flexibility to add a lot of cool stuff in the future, but at the potential cost of duplicity, choices and complexity. A previous post of mine goes over the official names of the EXIF fields used for comments in P2E and has a link to the standard.

http://www.picturestoexe.com/forums/index....amp;#entry40152

Anyway there are a number of header specifications available and different programs handle them differently and call them by different names. Individual specifications even allow multiple places to put comments. Each have pros and cons. Users tend to like the format that their chosen image software uses for obvious reasons, but it makes it difficult on the P2E developers to pick one over another. In addition to comments, there have been many other requests for other EXIF fields to add as well as other specifications. The developers have said they will add more in future releases, but hard to tell what they will chose among the hundreds if not thousands of possible fields.

There are actually 2 "Comments" fields for JPEG files.

There are many more than that. The EXIF specification itself has two places comments can be put.

There is one that is commonly referred to as "JPEG Comments" -- which is the one that is typically written into the file by a large majority of thumbnail editors/image management programs, and there is another called "User Comments" which is actually part of the EXIF spec.

I've looked for a reference for JPEG Comments but have not found it. I know many web pages use this general description to describe comment fields in many different specifications, from EXIF UserComment, to EXIF ImageDescription, to IPTC Caption, to TIFF ImageDescription, to XMP Description, to The JPEG Comment* - I'll use the asterisk to denote this particular field for the rest of this post. Unfortunately it has taken on a general definition in usage. Do you know what specification JPEG Comment* belongs to? I also don't think it is implemented uniformly. One drawback to using the JPEG Comment* field is most (all?) versions of Adobe Photoshop will delete it if you edit the picture after adding a JPEG Comment*. Kind of a pain.

To add to your confusion, the P2E developers don't call the EXIF fields by their proper names.

P2E name = Actual EXIF field name

JPEG EXIF Comments = UserComment

JPEG EXIF Description = ImageDescription

....

It (Exifer) can also read and write the typical "Comment" field written to by most of these other standard applications -- but it does so on a separate tab entitled "JPEG Comment". If you use this field, which again is the one that is most commonly written to by the vast majority of image management applications (and the most easily accessible field), it doesn't show up in P2E.

It doesn't matter what program you use to put text into the JPEG Comment* field, it won't show up in P2E because P2E currently doesn't support the JPEG Comment* field. It supports the EXIF UserComment and ImageDescription fields. It's probably better to use the EXIF UserComment field because it uses 2 byte characters (good for international letters) and most cameras will leave it blank. Some cameras, like my Olympus, will fill in the EXIF ImageDescription field with the camera make. So on slides you would like to have no comment you'll see the camera make.

FYI: If you use Exifer to write something in the description field, it will in fact show up in Adobe Bridge under the IPTC Core fields as "Description" and in ThumbsPlus, as well as IrfanView under the IPTC "Caption" field.

I think you may have filled in the wrong tab box. When I fill in the EXIF Description box in Exifer (yes I know these developers use the same wrong terms as P2E for the EXIF field names - but one bonus is Exifer and P2E use the same wrong names!) it shows up in the ImageDescription box of the EXIF window in Irfanview. Try it again.

So this is my reason for suggesting that it might make more sense to use IPTC information, if it is possible to get the information easily (and it can't be that difficult since it seems that most image management programs can do it).

Which field in the IPTC specification do you mean? The Caption? The Headline? Description? (which I think is the same as Caption, but not sure which one is the official field name). You started off this post talking alot about the JPEG Comment* field, which is not a IPTC field. So I'm not really sure what field you would like added to P2E. Whichever one(s) you want, you should add it to the Ideas and Suggestions For Next Versions forum of this board.

I agree with you that the IPTC fields have better editing support in the image applications I'm familiar with, such as Irfanview and Photoshop.

Steve Newcomb

Tucson, AZ USA

[Conflow]

Mary,

My apology, but I think you have changed the 'topic-subject' of this thread away from

the original problem posted by Argonaut...(see below)...but no matter.

You said,quoted:

OK, I stand corrected (somewhat) but here's the problem as far as I can tell...then you

engaged with Steve in a debate about your interpretation of Exif etc; and in so doing you

have missed the points I made previously concerning Argonauts problem.

I wish to clear up some points:-

EXIF/IPTC WERE NEVER DESIGNED TO BE PUBLIC DOMAIN PROGRAMS FOR THE PURPOSES

OF MANIPULATING AND EDITING IMAGE DATA. THEY ARE WYSIWYG STRICTLY FOR TRADE,

INDUSTRIAL, COMMERCIAL and LEGAL PURPOSES WITHIN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN.

Of course you can use the data ~ but Editing it is seriously frowned upon,to the extent,

that I only know of one person in Europe who has succeeded in writing a series of new

"Command Line Arguments" which can change all Comment Fields..That says something ?

The Origional Query from Argonaut:-

I use Lightroom for editing and tried a test image with *all* the Exif, IPTC etc. fields filled in,

and yet when I set PTE project options to "JPEG Exif Comment" and set it for all existing slides,

nothing came up when I previewed the slide. The "JPEG Exif Description" works just fine and

in Lightroom this field is the Caption field. So, where can I find the Comment field and display

it in PTE?....Argonaut

Steve Newcomb and myself have answered that query and I have posted "Examples" of

what's gone wrong. Steve has given you a full Summary about EXIF but please appreciate

that neither EXIF nor IPTC are our's to do with as we wish..they are not our property.

Steve is correct in saying 'whysiwyg' (in so many words), because its really down to the

EXIF Licensee as to what "Fields" they wishes to use in their Product's and quite rightly

there is considerable room for expansion.

Note: Dont forget that the Metafiles are generated with "Firmware" not Software so there

is little that can be modified except the Metadata and that 'corrupts' if modified too much,

and becomes unreadable if the Image is altered in any way.

Igor: Has very generously offered to include an EXIF Utility in PTE.5xxx but he is not under

any obligement to do so as it is a particularily difficult job.I do hope he abandons this until

such times that he is more comfortable with the progress of PTE.5xx.

The arguement as to which is better EXIF-v-IPTC is really a matter of conjecture and ones

own choice, because at the end of the day there is little one can do with either.

The 'Exifer Program' was designed by Friedemann Schmidt and some 20 Collegues with the

full co-operation of the JEITA Organisation ~ its the best one out there.

I hope this simple explaination puts EXIF/IPTC into perspective...

Brian.Conflow.

[Lin Evans]

Mary is correct in that there is vast confusion about the EXIF information and it indeed does not yet work correctly for Image Description. What we need to do, to simplify this for new users of PTE is to find an EXIF writing tool which allows access to both the comments and image description fields and which is easy to use.

As powerful as EXIFER is, I find it difficult and confusing to use to write EXIF data and personally much prefer Opanda Power EXIF for EXIF editing. I can enter information in the Image Description field using Opanda Power Exif and it appears in that field using IrfanView and other viewers, but it "will not" appear with the macro call in PTE. I can enter data in the User Comment field and the PTE macro call will retrieve it. We do then appear to still have a "bug" with PTE so Mary is correct.

If someone more familiar with how to easily use EXIFER to modify these fields cares to write a brief tutorial then perhaps we can recommend this or another tool which can write to these fields so we can add this information as an addenda to the User Guide. As is confusion still exists and it's going to until we can standardize answers. If someone has been able to get the Image Description feature to work I would be very happy to learn how!

Best regards,

Lin

[Conflow]

Lin,

We have to distinguish between the (Friedemann) "Exifer Program" and the "Exif Data"

coming down from one's Camera...

1)

The "Exif-Camera Data" is subject to a Trade Licence from the JEITA Organisation and

certain Data-Fields CAN NOT be changed this because of Firmware Agreements and

Copyright and Legal reasons.

2)

Changing certain 'Data-Fields' would negate the Legal Acceptability and viability of all

Photographs used in the Legal Profession and Geo-Physics and Marine GPS Surveys,etc.

Its that "raw-data" which has caught out so many Newspapers in Libel Actions....

3)

The "Friedemann Exifer Program" is bound by these constraints and you will notice that

you can only change certain "non-critical" Data-Fields and comments.

4)

Apart from the "EXIF Protected-Fields" (Firmware) each Manufacturer can write Metadata

to certain Fields for his own purposes and Products ~ so there is no Standard.

5)

If one wants to go 'under the counter' there are a few Programs on the "Black-Web"

which use 'command line arguements' to do anything you want. These are "illegal" and

bring the Photographic Industry into disrepute.....not my cup of tea,thank you !

Personally I don't see the point in changing EXIF-Data except for a 'Photo-Title' and

a re-edit of the numeric 'Image Size' to its new size and of course ones' own DataNotes.

I agree with Al Robinson ~ all he wants is the Exif Data ~ who would want more ?

Lets be honest, we don't own the Programs, nor have we purchased an EXIF Licence, so

what the heck are we expecting ??

Brian.Conflow.

[Lin Evans]

Hi Brian,

To call Image Description via macro in PTE is a "feature" which the developers have presented. As such it either works or does not work. Presently, it does not return the values in that field so is of no use and either should work or should be omitted. Image Description is used by a large number of photographers presently to briefly give a description of the place a photo was taken or brief information about the photograph.

Legal issues about EXIF information are largely moot in the photographic industry. Any number of programs including Adobe Photoshop quickly and easily strip the EXIF header completely which is the ultimate in terms of "modification". Any program which modifies these fields may or may not be in violation of copyright laws but the salient question goes much deeper than this. Does "anyone" have the right to attach something to my photo which I do not wish to be there. I own the copyright to my photo and that trumps any copyright someone might have to a file which is attached that I did not authorize. Bottom line is that this is a highly "grey" area of law to begin with.

Any number of existing programs including freeware such as Jalbum, Irfanview, etc., display the values in the Image Description field just as they have been written by the photographer. If this is not possible with PTE then that field because of licensing agreements or other reasons then this field should be omitted as a macro call. If it is possible then it should work properly. However, we must keep in mind that the competition easily displays all standard EXIF fields and some extended EXIF fields. Whether this takes an expensive license for commercial use or not I don't know, but I do know that it's very important to photographers and if PTE wants to court the photographers business it is an issue which needs to be addressed.

Perhaps this is the best argument for Mary's position that IPTC metadata may be more prudent to use and give the developers a work-around for any potential legal conflicts.

Best regards,

Lin

Lin,

We have to distinguish between the (Friedemann) "Exifer Program" and the "Exif Data"

coming down from one's Camera...

1)

The "Exif-Camera Data" is subject to a Trade Licence from the JEITA Organisation and

certain Data-Fields CAN NOT be changed this because of Firmware Agreements and

Copyright and Legal reasons.

2)

Changing certain 'Data-Fields' would negate the Legal Acceptability and viability of all

Photographs used in the Legal Profession and Geo-Physics and Marine GPS Surveys,etc.

Its that "raw-data" which has caught out so many Newspapers in Libel Actions....

3)

The "Friedemann Exifer Program" is bound by these constraints and you will notice that

you can only change certain "non-critical" Data-Fields and comments.

4)

Apart from the "EXIF Protected-Fields" (Firmware) each Manufacturer can write Metadata

to certain Fields for his own purposes and Products.

5)

If one wants to go 'under the counter' there are a few Programs on the "Black-Web"

which use 'command line arguements' to do anything you want. These are "illegal" and

bring the Photographic Industry into disrepute.....not my cup of tea,thank you !

Personally I don't see the point in changing EXIF-Data except for a 'Photo-Title' and a

re-edit of the numeric 'Image Size' to its new size and of course ones' own DataNotes.

Lets be honest, we don't own the Programs so what the heck are we expecting ??

Brian.Conflow.

[sanewcomb]

Hi Lin,

The P2E EXIF JPEG Description feature for adding comments embedded in images in the EXIF ImageDescription field works fine for me.

Using Exifer

1. Select the thumbnail of the image you want to add a comment to

2. Press Ctrl-E

3. Right Arrow Key to move to the EXIF tab

4. Fill in Description (or better yet, fill in the Comment) text box

5. press OK button

6. press No or Yes on whether to backup data

Good to go. It shows up in P2E as long as you follow the instructions for adding this type of template to the text comment object.

I highly recommend using the EXIF JPEG Comments template in P2E (EXIF Comment option in Exifer - I miswrote before the names were the same in P2E and Exifer, P2E has an additional 's' in the name) . All the cameras I've used leave this blank whereas several cameras have placed text into the EXIF ImageDescription field. Not a huge problem, but if you set the comment option for all the slides and don't add your text to this field, you'll see text when you probably want to see no caption.

Now there could still be a problem, but the problem could be in the program you are using. Hard to say which side is in error. Double check to see if the image file edited by Opanda places the comment in the correct field using Exifer. Then try saving this text directly in Exifer. Does that work? It may involve either Opanda using an illegal character in it's routine, or P2E not recognizing a character it should. It is tricky dealing with these types of undifined or poorly defined text strings. As I've stated before, the EXIF specification requires the ImageDescription field to be only 1 byte characters, whereas the UserComment field is 2 byte characters. If the developer of Opanda didn't observe this, there would be a problem in locating the control characters (such as marking the end of the field).

Brian,

What problem do you see people adding comments to their pictures? In my experience this has not corrupted the header and is readable no matter how many times edited. The name of the main field, UserComment seems to indicate this is what was intended, and I can't see how the developers expected people only to use their cameras to enter this data using arrow keys and a gridded alphabet chart.

Steve Newcomb

Tucson, AZ USA

[Lin Evans]

Hi Steve,

That's the problem - sometimes the comments field works and five minutes later it doesn't. It's not a procedural error - I do it exactly the same way each time and it "always" shows up in IrfanView, Jalbum, Photoshop, and other software programs. The Image Description as entered with Opanda works perfectly in other software and my other slideshow programs (other than PTE) have no problems at all displaying these fields so that leads me to believe that the problem is PTE specific.

I too see no problems in using these fields, we just need to get to the bottom of the bug which is causing so many to have issues with this. I'll try playing with EXIFER and see what the results are.

Best regards,

Lin

Hi Lin,

The P2E EXIF JPEG Description feature for adding comments embedded in images in the EXIF ImageDescription field works fine for me.

Using Exifer

1. Select the thumbnail of the image you want to add a comment to

2. Press Ctrl-E

3. Right Arrow Key to move to the EXIF tab

4. Fill in Description (or better yet, fill in the Comment) text box

5. press OK button

6. press No or Yes on whether to backup data

Good to go. It shows up in P2E as long as you follow the instructions for adding this type of template to the text comment object.

I highly recommend using the EXIF JPEG Comments template in P2E (EXIF Comment option in Exifer - I miswrote before the names were the same in P2E and Exifer, P2E has an additional 's' in the name) . All the cameras I've used leave this blank whereas several cameras have placed text into the EXIF ImageDescription field. Not a huge problem, but if you set the comment option for all the slides and don't add your text to this field, you'll see text when you probably want to see no caption.

Now there could still be a problem, but the problem could be in the program you are using. Hard to say which side is in error. Double check to see if the image file edited by Opanda places the comment in the correct field using Exifer. Then try saving this text directly in Exifer. Does that work? It may involve either Opanda using an illegal character in it's routine, or P2E not recognizing a character it should. It is tricky dealing with these types of undifined or poorly defined text strings. As I've stated before, the EXIF specification requires the ImageDescription field to be only 1 byte characters, whereas the UserComment field is 2 byte characters. If the developer of Opanda didn't observe this, there would be a problem in locating the control characters (such as marking the end of the field).

Brian,

What problem do you see people adding comments to their pictures? In my experience this has not corrupted the header and is readable no matter how many times edited. The name of the main field, UserComment seems to indicate this is what was intended, and I can't see how the developers expected people only to use their cameras to enter this data using arrow keys and a gridded alphabet chart.

Steve Newcomb

Tucson, AZ USA

[Conflow]

Lin,

I did not say that ~ Quoted:-

Brian...What problem do you see people adding comments to their pictures? In my experience this has not corrupted the header and is readable no matter how many times edited. The name of the main field, UserComment seems to indicate this is what was intended, and I can't see how the developers expected people only to use their cameras to enter this data using arrow keys and a gridded alphabet chart.....

I have no objections at all to people adding their own comments, what I said was:-

..."Personally I don't see the point in changing EXIF Data -except- for a 'PhotoTitle' and

a re-edit of the numeric 'Image Size' to its new size - and of course ones' own DataNotes.

These are all within the permissable editable Fields, no problems at all.

You must have misread my Post.

Cheers,

Brian.

[alrobin]

The Image Description as entered with Opanda works perfectly in other software and my other slideshow programs (other than PTE) have no problems at all displaying these fields so that leads me to believe that the problem is PTE specific.

Lin

I just wanted to confirm that both "Description" and "Comment" are picked up just fine by PTE in any of the tests I have made. In the attached examples the "Comment" was created in the camera, and the "Description" added in Exifer as it is not available from the camera.

Just to stir the pot a little more, it is interesting that MS Explorer show the same time for both "Date Modified" and "Date Picture Taken" (see attached), whereas both Exifer and PTE reflect the correct time when the image was modified to add the description field.

[Lin Evans]

Hi Al,

Here's where we are. It works for "some" all the time - for "most" some of the time and for some "none" of the time in PTE.

On my development system I can not get Description to work at all and comments sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. On Jalbum, Irfanview, Opanda Power Exif, Proshow Gold, and numberous other programs which display EXIF data the identical images "always" display the EXIF data. This leads me to believe that the problem essentially lies with PTE. Something in the way these EXIF data files are being called is not quite right for Description and Comments. On the other hand all the other EXIF data called by the macros "always" works perfectly in PTE.

That it works perfectly from the identical images (multiple images) with many other programs and not with PTE means that something with my system and PTE is causing the difficulty. But because it "does" always work with these other programs from the identical computer and with the identical files makes me believe that it's something specific to PTE which is ultimately causing the problem and that seems to be the case for a number of other users as well.

We do need to get to the bottom of this issue and find out how other programs are successfully reading and displaying the identical EXIF data all the time.

Best regards,

Lin

I just wanted to confirm that both "Description" and "Comment" are picked up just fine by PTE in any of the tests I have made. In the attached examples the "Comment" was created in the camera, and the "Description" added in Exifer as it is not available from the camera.

Just to stir the pot a little more, it is interesting that MS Explorer show the same time for both "Date Modified" and "Date Picture Taken" (see attached), whereas both Exifer and PTE reflect the correct time when the image was modified to add the description field.

[Lin Evans]

Here's a little experiment for you: Download the file linked below and "FIRST" use IrfanView to check the User Description and Comment. You will find content. If you have your browser set up to read EXIF information you will see the EXIF content of the Image Description field in the browser as well but the Comment reads as "not Defined". Now try it with other software. It always works. Now try to pull the content using PTE's macro call and see if it works for you. It does not work for me yet other images I add content to in exactly the same way work fine.

So the question is why can other readers read "both" the description AND comments while Foxfire browser finds the comments "undefined" but reads the Description and PTE won't read either? Is there something which is less rigorous in other readers which allows some leeway which PTE doesn't? If so what and why? So the bottom line is we still need a "reliable" way to write so both fields can "always" be read by PTE. Perhaps that's EXIFER - I don't know but I do know we need answers.....

This is the problem. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. With some images it does and with others it doesn't - no rhyme or reason....

UPDATE: EXIFER can read this file's comment and description - PTE can't. If I open the file in IrfanView and save it to a new name, PTE can read the comment and description. Obviously something is not right with the file, but other software can read the EXIF description and comment while PTE can't. Something about the read capability of other software is more robust and forgiving of problems in the EXIF field than PTE.....

http://www.lin-evans.net/p2e/IMG0298.JPG

Let me know if it works on your computer....

Best regards,

Lin