Digital Projector: what will the results be?

[goddi]

Greetings,

Our photography club is about to get into the digital presentation world. They are planning on purchasing the Canon Realis SX80 Mark II projector. The resolution is stated as 1400 x 1050. I make my shows with the aspect ratio at 16:9 and I make my MP4s at 1920 x 1080.

So my question is: What will happen when my exe's and MP4s are shown using this projector? I am concerned about the images being distorted or resized or whatever. I am not familiar with the ins and outs of using a projector. I also assume whatever laptop that is being use will have an effect???

Any input would be appreciated so I can understand if I have to alter the way I make a slideshow for this projector.

Thanks... Gary

[fh1805]

Gary,

The maximum size the projector can deliver is 1400x1050 pixels. Any PTE executable built to a size larger than that will be automatically downsized to fit. The downsizing should preserve the aspect ratio, giving black bands at top-bottom or left-right, as needed to fill the rest of the projected area. Any MP4 played back through it will be played back in some sort of Media Player software, which will be running inside a Windows window. The media player software used (plus Windows) should take care of the re-sizing of the video stream.

The key point to remember about a digital projector is that it is intended to project whatever is displayed on the computer monitor. So, if everything looks OK on the monitor, it should look OK when projected.

There will be some image degradation arising from the need to downsize 1920x1080 to 1400x788 (or thereabouts), but that is likely to pass un-noticed except by the most observant of viewers.

regards,

Peter

[davegee]

BEG THEM TO RECONSIDER!!!!!

1920x1080 is the way to go.

For shows from 4:3 right up to 16:9 you could be watching any AR at FULL RESOLUTION/ full height and throw more pixels at the screen than from the 4:3 projector.

For any slide show from 4:3 up to 16:9 on the 4:3 projector you have to size to the WIDTH or let the laptop do it for you.

For any slide show from 4:3 up to 16:9 on the 16:9 projector you just size to 1080 high and all ARs fit properly with no downsizing anywhere.

If you are only ever going to show 4:3 AVs then a 4:3 projector is OK.

We discussed this before - with 16:9 projectors available the old 4:3 makes no sense whatsoever.

We decided on an Epson 16:9 two years ago and haven't looked back or regreted it for a moment! The difference is immediately apparent.

Whatever you do a laptop/PC with an HDMI connector is essential (for 1920x1080). If your laptop/pc can be set to the same res as the projector you'll be OK. However, I'm not sure what res is chosen when using the HDMI connector on a 1400x1050.

Anyone else know?

DG

[goddi]

...We discussed this before - with 16:9 projectors available the old 4:3 makes no sense whatsoever.

We decided on an Epson 16:9 two years ago and haven't looked back or regreted it for a moment! The difference is immediately apparent....

DG

====================

Dave, I am still trying to digest all of this. In the meantime, which Epson did you get? I see that the 16x9 Canon is more than twice the price of the Canon Realis SX80 Mark II.

Gary

[Conflow]

Hi Gary,

You wrote..."Our photography club is about to get into the digital presentation world"

Firstly, I completely agree with DaveG and yes indeed this topic was discussed to the death

about 2 years ago and as Dave wrote ~"BEG THEM TO RECONSIDER"~ that was not an idle

comment but a sincere plea before your Club makes a decision it may bitterly regret.

Just to add to Daves comments, very few people know the difference between an 'Analog-Projector'

and a 'Digital-Projector' and worse still the difference between a 'Sequential-Image Projector'and a

'Storage-Image Projector' the latter by far is the better product as it can resolve fades and effects

and can be set for various Image-Sizes.

Its not for me to explain these things here but your Club should be advised to follow these maxims.

1)

Work out a Project-Sheet where the criteria must be..."What do you want the Projector do" ??

2)

What 'Media-Formats' must the Projector handle ?? (it will take some time to resolve that).

3)

Where will the Projector be used:- Small-Hall ? ~ Large-Hall ? or Mobile-Usage ?

4)

Get as much information on the selected 'Products-Shortlist' as possible ~ thats important.

Here below is a good "Projector-Review Site" which will help your Club with its deliberations

and may I suggest that you examine the 'Multi-Media' category.

Link: http://www.projectorreviews.com

and a Screenshot.

All the very best of luck with the project,

Brian (Conflow)

[goddi]

Hi Gary,

You wrote..."Our photography club is about to get into the digital presentation world"

Firstly, I completely agree with DaveG and yes indeed this topic was discussed to the death about 2 years ago and as Dave wrote ~"BEG THEM TO RECONSIDER"~ that was not an idle comment but a sincere plea before your Club makes a decision it may bitterly regret.

Just to add to Daves comments, very few people know the difference between an 'Analog-Projector' and a 'Digital-Projector' and worse still the difference between a 'Sequential-Image Projector'and a 'Storage-Image Projector' the latter by far is the better product as it can resolve fades and effects and can be set for various Image-Sizes.....

Brian (Conflow)

[/quo

==============================================

Brian,

Thanks very much for you comments. I took a look at the site you mentioned. I feel I am sinking is a sea of information but I don't know what to do with it. I don't think the club can afford a 1920x1080 projector because the ones I saw are several times more expensive, though I did see an Epson Home Cinema 8700 UB Projector with a resolution of 1920x1080 for $1899 after $100 rebate. But I don't know how to compare the quality at this point between the Canon and this Epson. Well, I will continue to try to figure this out but I don't think just looking at specs will really tell the tale.

Thanks, Gary

[goddi]

Greetings,

I found the brochure on this Canon Realis SX80 Mark II and it stated the following:

"Canon REALiS projectors operate

brilliantly in both 4:3 aspect ratio and

16:9 aspect ratio. So, no matter which

screen you own, you won't need to

purchase another."

http://i.b5z.net/i/u...e_10-2009_2.pdf

Is this sufficient to not worry about the 4:3 vs the 16:9 issue? I read that the LCOS projectors (as this Canon is) is highly recommended.

Gary

[Guest Yachtsman1]

Gary

Went through this dilemma 4 years ago when widescreen projection was just in its infancy. You mentioned "Camera Club" so presumeably you won't just be using the projector for AV, but also for conventional photography. This throws in other factors regarding colour projection, portrait & landscape ect. I will not try to influence you one way or another, but if you use this link, you will find lots of impartial information on what is available. Whatever you buy it will be a compromise between price & suitability, unless you have limitless funds, which I suspect you havent.

Link http://www.projectorpoint.co.uk/projector-advice-guide.htm

Regards Eric

Yachtsman1

[davegee]

Gary,

It would be foolish of anyone to recommend a specific projector to you.

However, from the brochure download, the is only one Canon there that I would be able to point you in the direction of:

The WUX10 is the only one with a Native Resolution which covers 1920x1080.

I don't understand why they have gone to 16:10 res (1920x1200), but it covers even more ground than the Epson. (Perhaps there's an Epson 16:10).

If you consider that 16:9 is the HDTV format and is likely to be with us until the next projector you buy is obsolete, then my preference would be 16:9.

Either is better than (IMHO) limiting your Club Members with a 4:3 projector at this stage in the game.

P.S. Don't forget that ANY 16:9 (1920x1080) projector is going to necessitate a Laptop/PC with HDMI output. If you don't have one you are (IMHO) wasting your time. The Laptop's screen SHOULD be 1920x1080 but if it is not the worse that can happen is that you won't be able to see the laptop screen when projecting at 1920x1080.

DG

[Barry Beckham]

I don't understand why they have gone to 16:10 res (1920x1200),

Because many photographers find 16:10 much better than 16:9

[davegee]

I KNEW that you would!

I almost put it in my post.

In some ways I agree with you Barry, but I think that because we are now NOT going to change all of the TV manufacturer's minds re: 16:9 and our hobby is closely aligned with TVs, I for one will stick with them.

(Even though my CURRENT computer monitor is 16:10).

There's also the fact that manufacturers of Projectors don't (in the main) make their products for Camera Enthusiasts - they make them (in the main) for the Home Cinema and Commercial market which is also closely aligned with the TV Industry.

It seems to me that the most obvious format to appeal to Camera Enthusiasts would be 3:2 but, and I have posed this question before, I don't think anyone makes one?

DG

[goddi]

Gary,

It would be foolish of anyone to recommend a specific projector to you.

However, from the brochure download, the is only one Canon there that I would be able to point you in the direction of:

The WUX10 is the only one with a Native Resolution which covers 1920x1080.

I don't understand why they have gone to 16:10 res (1920x1200), but it covers even more ground than the Epson. (Perhaps there's an Epson 16:10).

If you consider that 16:9 is the HDTV format and is likely to be with us until the next projector you buy is obsolete, then my preference would be 16:9.

Either is better than (IMHO) limiting your Club Members with a 4:3 projector at this stage in the game.

P.S. Don't forget that ANY 16:9 (1920x1080) projector is going to necessitate a Laptop/PC with HDMI output. If you don't have one you are (IMHO) wasting your time. The Laptop's screen SHOULD be 1920x1080 but if it is not the worse that can happen is that you won't be able to see the laptop screen when projecting at 1920x1080.

DG

===================

Dave,

I did see the WUX10 but the price is beyond our club's budget. The SX80 is on sale for $2,290 and the WUX10 is going for $5,563. It is unfortunate that we don't have the bucks for the better projector. But I still don't understand, if the brochure says "the projector operate brilliantly in both 4:3 aspect ratio and 16:9 aspect ratio", what am I missiing here? It seems to be telling me that it will show the 16:9 format as the WUX10 will. Perhaps the SX80 will show the 16:9 as a smaller footprint on the screen than the WUX10??? Most of the use will be for individual digital photographs but I am trying to get the club into displaying PTE type slideshows.

Thanks, Gary

[goddi]

Gary

Went through this dilemma 4 years ago when widescreen projection was just in its infancy. You mentioned "Camera Club" so presumeably you won't just be using the projector for AV, but also for conventional photography. This throws in other factors regarding colour projection, portrait & landscape ect. I will not try to influence you one way or another, but if you use this link, you will find lots of impartial information on what is available. Whatever you buy it will be a compromise between price & suitability, unless you have limitless funds, which I suspect you havent.

Link http://www.projector...dvice-guide.htm

Regards Eric

Yachtsman1

===========================

Thanks for the link, Eric. But I notice that they don't even mention the LcOS projectors. That seems to be the newer technology. Things change so fast it is difficult to get info on the cutting edge. But it has some good basic info. Limitless funds? Nope!

Gary

[nelson]

Hello Gary,

Our club purchased the projector you are looking at last month.

It was recommended to us by three other clubs.

We are fortunate because we project onto a 30 ft plus screen so aspect ratios do not really come into play.

The price point for this type of projector can`t be beat. We looked at others with higher resolutions and found this suited us perfectly.

It looks great no matter what aspect ratio you project at.

Kieron

[goddi]

Hello Gary,

Our club purchased the projector you are looking at last month.

It was recommended to us by three other clubs.

We are fortunate because we project onto a 30 ft plus screen so aspect ratios do not really come into play.

The price point for this type of projector can`t be beat. We looked at others with higher resolutions and found this suited us perfectly.

It looks great no matter what aspect ratio you project at.

Kieron

===============

Kieron,

Thanks very much for the confirmation. At least we will be in the same boat! I will pass on your comments to our club's president.

Sincerely, Gary

[davegee]

Gary,

It's not just about ASPECT RATIO - we've been through all this before.

On a 4:3 1400x1050 projector you can project ANY AR you desire.

On a 16:9 1920x1080 projector you can project ANY AR you desire.

A 4:3 image (1440x1080) is going to look equally good on either projector.

On a 4:3 (1400x1050) Projector a 16:9 image (1920x1080 original Size) becomes 1400x788 (1.1032MP) on screen regardless of the size of screen.

On a 16:9 (1920x1080) Projector a 16:9 image (1920x1080 original Size) is 1920x1080 (2.076MP) on screen regardless of screen size.

That's twice as much definition etc etc etc......................................

3:2 images pro rata....................

I REALLY do appreciate your comments about funding etc, but with a 4:3 1400x1050 projector you will be behind the race already and starting out on old technology.

Good luck with your decision - and welcome to Digital Competition.

DG

[goddi]

Gary,

It's not just about ASPECT RATIO - we've been through all this before.

On a 4:3 1400x1050 projector you can project ANY AR you desire.

On a 16:9 1920x1080 projector you can project ANY AR you desire.

A 4:3 image (1440x1080) is going to look equally good on either projector.

On a 4:3 (1400x1050) Projector a 16:9 image (1920x1080 original Size) becomes 1400x788 (1.1032MP) on screen regardless of the size of screen.

On a 16:9 (1920x1080) Projector a 16:9 image (1920x1080 original Size) is 1920x1080 (2.076MP) on screen regardless of screen size.

That's twice as much definition etc etc etc......................................

3:2 images pro rata....................

I REALLY do appreciate your comments about funding etc, but with a 4:3 1400x1050 projector you will be behind the race already and starting out on old technology.

Good luck with your decision - and welcome to Digital Competition.

DG

============================

Dave,

I really appreciate that you putting together the above data. It helps to understand what is going on. The bottom line seems to be the money. I think the best we can do is the SX80. I recently have seen two slide/AV presentations with two different projectors that would not be acceptable for any digital competition, in my opinion. This Canon SX80 should be a big improvement. But, unless we rob a bank....

Thanks... Gary