Jerky video from D7000 in PTE 7

[smokinggoldfish]

Hi everyone,

I have just upgraded to PTE Deluxe 7.0 so that I can use video clips in my AV sequences. My first attempt is very disappointing though. A high definition 1920 by 1080 24 fps "high quality" MOV video shot with my Nikon D7000 plays OK in Windows Media player or Windows Live Movie Maker, but is very jerky in the PTE preview - either the preview window or the full screen preview. The sound is OK but it looks as though only a small proportion of the frames are being displayed. I tried converting the video file to the .converted.avi format using PTE but the result is still bad. And making a .exe file and running that did not improve things. Looks like I am up against some sort of software or hardware speed limitation? But the PC is quite new and running Windows 7 Home Premium. The processor is quad core 64 bit and I have 4GB RAM.

Am I doing something stupid? Any suggestions?

[davegee]

Make a short clip available so that others (mainly Igor) can try it?

Use DROPBOX or MEDIAFIRE or similar.

DG

[smokinggoldfish]

Further to my post: I have just tried shooting a test clip at the lowest video quality/resolution that the D7000 offers, i.e. 640 by 424 pixels and 25 fps. That seems to load and run fine in PTE, so I guess I will try something in between the two extremes.....

[fh1805]

Hi smokinggoldfish,

Seems like you and I are on the same learning curve!

Peter

[smokinggoldfish]

Thanks DG, I have never used DROPBOX before but it looks straightforward, so I have put 2 clips in there, one low quality 640 by 424 25 fps, and the other 1920 by 1080 24 fps. See

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/72061037/DSC_2538.MOV

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/72061037/DSC_2539.MOV

Please feel free to try and to comment, anyone, especially Igor,

Thanks,

sg

[davegee]

Ummmmm,

Can I suggest that you put it on a tripod?

It has been suggested elsewhere here, and quite rightly so, that the subject should move and not the camera.

For the purposes of this type of testing it would be desirable?

Why not put it on a tripod and walk in front of the camera and lower the projector screen or similar?

For what it is worth, I am not seeing any "dropped" frames - just user induced unsteady video (highest quality).

DG

[Guest Yachtsman1]

Both look like hand held problems to me, try videoing a moving object with the camera on a tripod.

Yachtsman1.

Snap

[smokinggoldfish]

Thanks for the comments about using a tripod. The original clips were indeed shot with a tripod, and were of me talking. But they were rather long so I shot these two quick ones hand-held. I'll shoot a couple more from a tripod, so that you can hopefully see the problem.

sg

[smokinggoldfish]

I have put two more tripod shots on dropbox of my hand moving in front of the camera. The low res one runs smoothly in PTE while the his res one jumps badly:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/72061037/DSC_2541.MOV

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/72061037/DSC_2542.MOV

sg

[davegee]

I tried the original MOV file - Smooth as silk - absolutely no dropped frames, stuttering or any problem that I can detect.

W7, i7 2600 CPU @ 3.4GHz; 8Gb RAM; nVidia GT 545 with 3Gb RAM.

DG

P.S. I then allowed the converter to do its job at default settings and no trimming - exactly the same - could tell no difference between original and converted.

DG

[Lin Evans]

Hi,

I too have the Nikon D7000 and my videos run glass smooth in PTE regardless of resolution. I'm wondering if perhaps there may be some issue with drivers or possibly video card. I'm running Win XP with 4 gig RAM and an older nVidia 8800 GT with 512 meg RAM.

Best regards,

Lin

I have put two more tripod shots on dropbox of my hand moving in front of the camera. The low res one runs smoothly in PTE while the his res one jumps badly:

http://dl.dropbox.co...37/DSC_2541.MOV

http://dl.dropbox.co...37/DSC_2542.MOV

sg

[smokinggoldfish]

Thanks DG,

so it looks as though my computer can't keep up with the data rate? I have less RAM and I think my video "card" is inferior. If so does this mean that my finished exe file won't run except on a very fast machine like yours?

sg

[smokinggoldfish]

Thanks Lin,

my graphics "card" is an AMD Radeon HD 6530D with 512 MB dedicated memory and 1529 MB shared (system) memory. The graphics capability does seem to be the weak point in the "Windows Experience Index" scoring only 4.5. I have no idea what this number means but it is the lowest one - the other hardware all gets a better rating. Is there a way to test graphics performance e.g. with a utility that I can download?

sg

[davegee]

sg,

I wish I could help you more but I can only tell you what I see (as did Lin).

I bought a new PC recently to replace my 7 year old Media PC and went for the highest spec off-the-shelf that was available from that well know PC retailer in the high street.

I was running XP prior to that and never had video problems with a 512Mb card and 2Gb RAM.

You could list your EXACT spec with make and model of the card to see if it rings any bells with anyone - perhaps you and Peter have something in common?

I will try your file on my Vista Laptop tomorrow to see if there is any difference.

DG

[smokinggoldfish]

Thanks again DG,

attached is a screen dump of my system spec. Maybe someone can spot something significant. I'll also try to run the clips on my laptop - seems unlikely to be better but worth a try,

sg

[smokinggoldfish]

Just to add to my last post:

The laptop does not perform any better than the desktop - the HD file runs in a very jerky way while the low def file is quite smooth.....?

sg

[fh1805]

Can I suggest that you put it on a tripod?

For the purposes of this type of testing it would be desirable?

That's the conclusion I have come to. I need to take some video that I know is silky-smooth and rock-steady. Then, and only then, can I make a true judgement about jerkiness.

Peter

[fh1805]

...perhaps you and Peter have something in common?

When my desktop crashed last summer I deliberately chose a low capability graphics card because I didn't want to end up building sequences that would not run smoothly on my laptop (which I use to drive the projector when "on the road"). I have already made a mental note that the move into video might sound the death knell for the laptop.

Peter

[Lin Evans]

Hi SG,

The video card is likely at least part of the problem. If you go here:

http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/

Click on the "Search For Your Video Card" and type in "6530D" you will find that it ranks 258th with a G3D rating of 540. A decent video card today will have a G3D rating of probably better than 1400 and the top one is 3958 so probably investing in a new video card would definitely help. Laptops are generally worse than desktops and one has to be careful when choosing a laptop to get one with a good video card as well as good CPU and RAM performance.

On your desktop, before you do anything, check and see if you have an open slot to plug in a video card (yours "could" be built into the motherboard) and also that you have available power cables from the power supply. I had to buy a new power supply for my Dell Inspiron 530 because it had no available power - all leads were used. I put a micro quiet 750W power supply in (had to shoehorn it into the case) and the new video card (this was about four years or more ago) and it made all the difference in the world for animation smoothness and video.

Best regards,

Lin

Just to add to my last post:

The laptop does not perform any better than the desktop - the HD file runs in a very jerky way while the low def file is quite smooth.....?

sg

[RobertAlbright]

It is very likely than Lin is right about the video card. In my experience, travelling around widely and seeing my and other people's AV's shown on different computers, it is usually an inadequate graphics card that leads to problems.

As it happens, I am looking for a laptop with the right graphics card and full HD screen (1920x1080px) for AV to include HD video. The prices are extraordinary - the best price I found was £550 ($850) for a Sony Vaio and this was basic requirement fulfillment. To buy an i7 machine with upgraded graphics card you're talking £800 ($1300) and upwards.

Unlike most things computing, the prices of laptops seem not to have fallen in recent years.

[Guest Yachtsman1]

Hi Robert

Have you tried speccing your own with http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/, I went this route with my last LT a couple of months ago.

Regards Eric

Yachtsman1.

[smokinggoldfish]

Thanks to Robert, Lin, and Yachtsman1 for your helpful comments. After some thought I have decided to concentrate for now on the content of my sequences, and if the video clips have to be in a smaller resolution in order for the hardware to cope, then so be it. I will upgrade the video card later. But then I will face the job of upgrading or renewing the laptop too, so it is looking expensive. Sometimes I have to remind myself that this is supposed to be fun!

sg

[Conflow]

Smoking Goldfish and All,

Concerning your 'Jerky Mov-Files' it has nothing to do with Handshake nor Video-Cards nor poor PC's...

There is absolutely no need to upgrade your 'Video-Card' at this point in time until you try the following.

But first I wish to make a few point which may benefit all contributors to this very confused topic.

1)

There is nothing mysterious about MOV-Movie Clips once you appreciate some points about their format.

Most Mov-Files have 5-Data Streams: 1-Video, 1-Audio, 1-Metadata, 2-Binaries streams.

2)

The reproduction problems are as follows:-

** The 24.Fps Output-format gives immense trouble to Professional-Film Studios and Editors alike (more later)

** The 25-30-50-60 Fps-formats give no trouble with 'Multi-Media-Players' with a full set of Apple-binaries.

** Without the Apple-binaries most popular Multi-Media-Players will give trouble in 1920x1080 but O.K in 640x424.

** As 1920x1080 is not an established TV-Industrial-Standard ~ Apple streaming-standards are still in development.

** Windows-Media-Player will not handle Apple Mov-Files for obvious reasons of Corporate competition.

** Other problems are created by the 'User' who did not use an "SD-Card rated HC-HD @ 4,6,8" Speed-factor.

3)

Is there a foolproof remedy to those problems ?...Yes there is and its quite simple but often overlooked and criticized

by those who have never understood the problem nor researched for a solution.

The-Solution

Convert the Mov-Files into (uncompressed) Avi-Files with a Converter equipped with the necessary Apple-binaries installed.

We choose the 'Pazera.Mov-Avi Converter' which has been in use now for the past year and gives excellent 'Lossless' results.

There are other Converters available some good some bad but you need to research those for yourselves.

Concerning the 24.Fps in 1000.millesecs (1.second) this gives of 41.666666.mS/Frame which is unresolvable in Digital-System

consequently the timing/per/frame has to be altered but then recorrected every 12 or 24 Frames to maintain synchronisation.

The Camera-Software can do this by altering the rate to 25.Fps or alternatively the Pazera.Mov-Avi Converter will do similar.

Below are your 2 Mov-Files converted to (lossless) AVI which must be played on Windows Media-Player for best quality.

http://www.mediafire.com/?babca2lgsmtd262

http://www.mediafire.com/?jsfaaxlv0dyfcip

Also shown as attachments some other Files which may be of interest to others.

Hope this helps,

Brian.(Conflow

[Lin Evans]

Hi Brian,

The only problem I have with understanding the issue he is having is that when he puts his D7000 original MOV in PTE it plays jerky on his two systems. When David played SG's MOV on David's system it played perfectly.

When I put my original D7000 MOV in PTE it plays perfectly smooth and likewise for several others who are using D7000 videos. Assuming SG has the same software as everyone else from Nikon including any necessary codecs, etc., doesn't this then indicate some difference in "hardware" between his system and others?

Best regards,

Lin

[Lin Evans]

Hi Brian,

The only problem I have with understanding the issue he is having is that when he puts his D7000 original MOV in PTE it plays jerky on his two systems. When David played SG's MOV on David's system it played perfectly.

When I put my original D7000 MOV's in PTE they play perfectly smoothly and likewise for several others who are using D7000 videos. Assuming SG has the same software as everyone else from Nikon including any necessary codecs, etc., doesn't this then indicate some difference in "hardware" between his system and others? This is not to say that there could not be a "software" conversion "solution," but that the actual problem he is having playing the original MOV file smoothly on his two systems is likely hardware based?

Best regards,

Lin