Laptop-configuration

[goddi]

Greetings,

I am trying to decide on a laptop. Not having used one before on a regular basis, I have a lot of questions. But one configuration that can determine which set of models to zero in on is the screen size/resolution.

I'd love to get the new Toshiba Qosmio X75. It has the Haswell 4th generation processor; i7; and can get SSD cache and large HDs and longer battery life (then the n non-Haswell models). But the problem is that it only comes as a 17". I did not have a problem with this size at first but most people are saying it is really too big and heavy to tote around. But I like it because the monitor is 1920x1080. Matches my desktop monitor.

Having looked around at 15" models, their screens are more like 1366x768, for example. So my question is, what is the effect when viewing a PTE show created on a 1920x1080 monitor and played on a lower res screen. Since the aspect ratio is the same, I assume it will fit the screen the same. However, what about the quality of the viewing of the show?

Thanks... Gary

[davegee]

Gary,

Don't compromise. You need that HD screen. You need a dedicated card. You need HDMI to connect to TV or your desktop monitor.

DG

[goddi]

Gary,

Don't compromise. You need that HD screen. You need a dedicated card. You need HDMI to connect to TV or your desktop monitor.

DG

================================

Dave,

Yes, I am trying not to compromise. But almost every thing I look at has some deficient hardware in it. But...I just took a look at the Lenovo IdeaPad Y510p (59370005). It has 4th gen; 2.4GHz; 15.6" display; Nividia GT750M w/2Gb; 8 Gbs Ram; 1TB 5400+24Gb SSD; DVD drive; HDMI out. A bit heavy at 6 lbs. Hmmmm... The problem is I can't find it in any story around here to actually see it and test it out.

But I guess there is hope. I'll have to keep checking around.

Gary

[davegee]

Gary,

I have no idea what brands you have over there.

I stick with what I know will LAST.

If/when I replace this one - I will go as near to the top of the Sony Range as I can afford/justify/get away with.

Desktops - different - I have bought the best Media PCs I could get on the High Street - HP does it for me.

I have heard so many horror stories from people/friends getting Custom Built - forget it. It works for some but not for all.

WRT screens less than HD. It's OK until you connect up to your HD Projector or TV and then you start getting the hassle because the LT's screen is not the same as the TV/Projector.

Believe me HD is easier.

Now stand by for "other opinions".

DG

[goddi]

Gary,

Don't compromise. You need that HD screen. You need a dedicated card. You need HDMI to connect to TV or your desktop monitor.

DG

===============================

I see that Toshiba just came out with the Toshiba Satellite P50-ABT2G22 Laptop. It is customizable and the 15.6" screen's resolution is 1920x1080. It tooks pretty good. It has the Haswell and i7. And the HDMI output has the '4K capability' (not sure if this will be useful but who knows...).

Gary

[Barry Beckham]

Gary

What is the reason you're looking at a laptop? I know that sounds a daft question, but many people use them when portability and space isn't an issue with them at all. Just interested in what drives you towards a laptop

[goddi]

Gary

What is the reason you're looking at a laptop? I know that sounds a daft question, but many people use them when portability and space isn't an issue with them at all. Just interested in what drives you towards a laptop

===============================

Now that is a really good question. And I am constantly asking myself that same question. It's not that I really need one on a regular basis. What triggered my searching for one is that my photo club wants me to put on a demo of the PTE program next season. I don't want to just show the slideshows but I want to show how to actually create a slideshow using PTE. The only way is to have the program on a laptop and have everything set up to work properly.

I don't want to take the chance using someone else's laptop. The worse thing is to have something fail during the presentation. And I figure if I am going to get one, get a good one. Also, I'd like one to have downstairs in my home so I can do research on the laptop without having to run upstairs to my desktop PC. Getting lazy...maybe. It is a matter of convenience, I guess. It has been impossible to find a laptop that I liked but I think this new Toshiba model can be configured to pretty much how I would like it.

Gary

[Guest Yachtsman1]

Gary

I upgrade my LT last year, (custom made to my spec) unfortunately I chose a 15inch screen, since wished I'd gone for the 17inch, my peepers ain't what they used to be. An alternative to a live demo is to record a demo on your PC using something like Camtasia, edit out the bloopers, add it to a PTE show & create an exe file which should run on any decent machine, then sit back & enjoy it with your audience, less stressful. :blink: .

Regards Eric

Yachtsman1.

[goddi]

Gary

I upgrade my LT last year, (custom made to my spec) unfortunately I chose a 15inch screen, since wished I'd gone for the 17inch, my peepers ain't what they used to be. An alternative to a live demo is to record a demo on your PC using something like Camtasia, edit out the bloopers, add it to a PTE show & create an exe file which should run on any decent machine, then sit back & enjoy it with your audience, less stressful. .

Regards Eric

Yachtsman1.

=============================

Yea...I keep going back and forth between a 15" and 17". When I look at the 17", it does not look too big...but then the little added weight...I just don't know. I'd rather do a live demo because I'd rather see a live demo if someone else was presenting one. I can see recorded ones on YouTube. It just is not the same, especially for a small photo club like we have. Not having used a laptop before, makes it very difficult to decide what I really want....:(/>:(/>:(/>

Who knows??? I'll just have to keep asking myself questions.

Gary

[Barry Beckham]

Gary

That makes sense.

I personally dislike laptops for any photographic work. I find the screens too small and it's hard to determine the right tone and contrast on images being worked on. I appreciate that this is getting better as laptops get better too. I have demonstrated for years and always used a desktop for that. Working on the idea that I would have a PC projector, large prints, speakers, keyboard etc. The car was already full of kit so a desktop didn't add much more. Now in Australia I have moved to a laptop, but they are a pain in tha backside sometimes.

Even when you get a really powerful one, they never seem to handle things as well as the same spec desktop. In theory (spec) my laptop should be better than my old PC that I use for making videos, but it isn't in practice. Pay attention to the keyboard of the laptop you buy. Some put those stupid keys down the left hand side to open things like a calculator, but as a demonstrator we are used to those bottom left keys being Shift and Control. I made a mistake when buying my laptop and I never paid attention to that. I am ALWAYS hitting those keys in error because the keyboard on the laptop is different to the desktop. It's something worth looking at before you buy.

If you have another large keyboard that will USB into the laptop, think about using that, particulalry if that keyboard is a white one. The craze at present is for black keyboards, but as soon as the lights go down in the clubroom a black keyboard is impossible to see. I have an old white keyboard that I use, but they are hard to find in shops right now. An alternative is to get one of those USB lamps so at least you have a light on the keyboard for when you need it.

Next laptop I buy will have as large as screen that is available or that I can aford to buy. I will also pay attention to the keyboard too. Take a USB stick to the store and ask to see a heavy PTE slide show running. I found that when I did that, some higher spec laptops didn't handle it very well. I was surprised at how badly some of them did given the spec and price

[goddi]

Gary

That makes sense.

I personally dislike laptops for any photographic work. I find the screens too small and it's hard to determine the right tone and contrast on images being worked on. I appreciate that this is getting better as laptops get better too. I have demonstrated for years and always used a desktop for that. Working on the idea that I would have a PC projector, large prints, speakers, keyboard etc. The car was already full of kit so a desktop didn't add much more. Now in Australia I have moved to a laptop, but they are a pain in tha backside sometimes.

Even when you get a really powerful one, they never seem to handle things as well as the same spec desktop. In theory (spec) my laptop should be better than my old PC that I use for making videos, but it isn't in practice. Pay attention to the keyboard of the laptop you buy. Some put those stupid keys down the left hand side to open things like a calculator, but as a demonstrator we are used to those bottom left keys being Shift and Control. I made a mistake when buying my laptop and I never paid attention to that. I am ALWAYS hitting those keys in error because the keyboard on the laptop is different to the desktop. It's something worth looking at before you buy.

If you have another large keyboard that will USB into the laptop, think about using that, particulalry if that keyboard is a white one. The craze at present is for black keyboards, but as soon as the lights go down in the clubroom a black keyboard is impossible to see. I have an old white keyboard that I use, but they are hard to find in shops right now. An alternative is to get one of those USB lamps so at least you have a light on the keyboard for when you need it.

Next laptop I buy will have as large as screen that is available or that I can aford to buy. I will also pay attention to the keyboard too. Take a USB stick to the store and ask to see a heavy PTE slide show running. I found that when I did that, some higher spec laptops didn't handle it very well. I was surprised at how badly some of them did given the spec and price

================================

I took a closer look at the keyboard on the Toshiba since you mentioned it. The layout looks pretty similar to my Microsoft keyboard, only missing some duplicate keys that I never use anyway (attached). The keys are black. I've never seen a white keyboard...but this Toshiba has backlite keys. I guess this would help in low-light situations. Yes, I do take a memory stick and test out various laptops at the store. The problem with the Toshiba that I like is that no one has it in stock yet. And if I want to customize it, I am pretty sure a store would not do it. I would rather buy a laptop locally so I have someone to talk to face to face when there is a problem. It they do come out in stores, I guess I will have to go with the pre-built models.

Gary

[goddi]

Gary

...Next laptop I buy will have as large as screen that is available or that I can aford to buy. I will also pay attention to the keyboard too. Take a USB stick to the store and ask to see a heavy PTE slide show running. I found that when I did that, some higher spec laptops didn't handle it very well. I was surprised at how badly some of them did given the spec and price....

====================================

Speaking of specs, I am not sure how to evaluate the possible choices of hard drives. Some are available only in 'custom' built and some in prebuilt. I am not sure how each would affect using PTE, in creating or showing the slideshows. Since I don't have one to test, can someone give some idea how they rate?

1- 1.0TB (5400 RPM, Serial ATA)

2- 1.0TB (5400rpm); Hybrid 8G Serial ATA hard disk drive

3- 1.256TB: 256GB mSATA Solid State Drive (SSD) + 1TB (5400rpm) Hybrid HDD

4- 256GB Solid State Drive (Serial ATA, SSD)

5- 750GB HDD (5400rpm, Serial ATA)

6- 1.0TB: 500GB (7200rpm, Serial ATA) + 500GB (7200rpm, Serial ATA)

I am leaning towards the #2, #3, or #6. The size and speed seem to be optimum but I really don't know how to decide.

Choosing the specific Toshiba's (4th generation) model will determine which hard drive it will have but I am not sure of the pros and cons of the different possibilities (durability, speed, heat, noise???)

Can anyone enlighten me on these choices???

Gary

[Guest Yachtsman1]

Gary

The most important component for AV is the video card IMO.

Regards Eric

Yachtsman1.

[goddi]

Gary

The most important component for AV is the video card IMO.

Regards Eric

Yachtsman1.

=================================

Yes, that is right. But since both are independent (not integrated) graphics cards, I figure either would be pretty good.

The 17" has a 3GB GDDR5 Nvidia GeForce GTX 770M w/ Nvidia Optimus.

The 15" has a 2GB GDDR5 Nvidia GeForce GT 740M w/ Nvidia Optimus.

Gary

[cjdnzl]

Are you aware that most, if not all laptops have 6-bit screens, not 8-bit as your desktop will have. They look ok, but 6-bit screens are useless for accurate colour work, even if calibrated.

I have a Dell laptop with a 1650 x 1080 6-bit screen, not bad to look at, but I do not do any photoshop type work on it. It's ok to put shows together with images from my desktop, but I wouldn't use it for working on an image.

The computer itself works in any image bit depth, 8 or 16-bit as required, but the screen will only display 6-bit images. An 8-bit external monitor will show 8 bits, just not the laptop screen.

[Barry Beckham]

I agree, those backlit keys are well worth having if you're going to use the laptop to demonstrate with. I quite like the idea of a solid state drive and will be going that way in my next desktop. A friend has just got one and it certainly seems sweet by what I have seen. If you choose that route then as you have discovered the size is restricted a bit, but that will depend how you work. Most if those solid state drives will be large enough for most of us, if we restrict it to just the OS and programs

Externals are not expensive and I never store images on a C drive anyway. Would one of those help the heat issue too? I suppose it would, but then if I were buying a laptop I would expect that issue to have been dealt with by the manufacturer

I do agree with Colin though that they are not good for really top class Photoshop work. We go away a lot and shoot images and I can look at them on the laptop, but I can't work on them because when I get home and see them on the desktop I want to start again.

[crossfade]

I personally dislike laptops for any photographic work. I find the screens too small and it's hard to determine the right tone and contrast on images being worked on. I appreciate that this is getting better as laptops get better too. I have demonstrated for years and always used a desktop for that. Working on the idea that I would have a PC projector, large prints, speakers, keyboard etc. The car was already full of kit so a desktop didn't add much more. Now in Australia I have moved to a laptop, but they are a pain in tha backside sometimes.

YOu can always plug the laptop into a desktop monitor. Best of both worlds.

Even when you get a really powerful one, they never seem to handle things as well as the same spec desktop. In theory (spec) my laptop should be better than my old PC that I use for making videos, but it isn't in practice. Pay attention to the keyboard of the laptop you buy. Some put those stupid keys down the left hand side to open things like a calculator, but as a demonstrator we are used to those bottom left keys being Shift and Control. I made a mistake when buying my laptop and I never paid attention to that. I am ALWAYS hitting those keys in error because the keyboard on the laptop is different to the desktop. It's something worth looking at before you buy.

If the specs are the same they should perform the same. If you're seeing a difference then something about them is not the same. The bit about different keyboards between laptop and desktop is a good one, but I solved that by not using a desktop anymore. I just plug the laptop into a big LCD display. One computer, and no more wondering which version is on which machine.

If you have another large keyboard that will USB into the laptop, think about using that, particulalry if that keyboard is a white one. The craze at present is for black keyboards, but as soon as the lights go down in the clubroom a black keyboard is impossible to see. I have an old white keyboard that I use, but they are hard to find in shops right now. An alternative is to get one of those USB lamps so at least you have a light on the keyboard for when you need it.

Backlit keyboard.

Next laptop I buy will have as large as screen that is available or that I can aford to buy. I will also pay attention to the keyboard too. Take a USB stick to the store and ask to see a heavy PTE slide show running. I found that when I did that, some higher spec laptops didn't handle it very well. I was surprised at how badly some of them did given the spec and price

Try it on a MacBook Pro booted into Windows. You might be surprised.

[Barry Beckham]

:rolleyes:/>

[goddi]

Are you aware that most, if not all laptops have 6-bit screens, not 8-bit as your desktop will have. They look ok, but 6-bit screens are useless for accurate colour work, even if calibrated.

I have a Dell laptop with a 1650 x 1080 6-bit screen, not bad to look at, but I do not do any photoshop type work on it. It's ok to put shows together with images from my desktop, but I wouldn't use it for working on an image.

The computer itself works in any image bit depth, 8 or 16-bit as required, but the screen will only display 6-bit images. An 8-bit external monitor will show 8 bits, just not the laptop screen.

======================================

I have been trying to find more specs for the screen for the Toshiba Qosmio X70 laptop. It seems to be top secret information!! I have called Sales, Customer Service, Tech Support and Repair (though they would not even answer the phone).

My desktop's Samsung monitor is 'True Color 32-bit'. Is this a comparable spec to what you are talking about? I put a question on a Toshiba Forum site so I will report back if I get any answer from them.

This Toshiba laptop has "built-in HDMI® output feature to view your 4K Ultra HD digital content on the latest TVs". And it has "Resoluton+" that is supposed to improve the viewing of DVDs and videos from camcorders. So there is hope that it has a better laptop screen but without the detailed specs, there is no way to really know.

But, this doesn't mean that the laptop's screen will show any more than 6 or 8 bit color depth (?).

Gary

[cjdnzl]

======================================

I have been trying to find more specs for the screen for the Toshiba Qosmio X70 laptop. It seems to be top secret information!! I have called Sales, Customer Service, Tech Support and Repair (though they would not even answer the phone).

My desktop's Samsung monitor is 'True Color 32-bit'. Is this a comparable spec to what you are talking about? I put a question on a Toshiba Forum site so I will report back if I get any answer from them.

This Toshiba laptop has "built-in HDMI® output feature to view your 4K Ultra HD digital content on the latest TVs". And it has "Resoluton+" that is supposed to improve the viewing of DVDs and videos from camcorders. So there is hope that it has a better laptop screen but without the detailed specs, there is no way to really know.

But, this doesn't mean that the laptop's screen will show any more than 6 or 8 bit color depth (?).

Gary

There are a couple of ways to find the bit-depth your monitor has. The response speed is one, screens that boast a 2 millisecond response are almost certain to be 6-bit, most 8-bit screens are 5 msec. The other way is the quoted number of colours it wll display. This is calculated by multiplying out the bit depth for the each of the three primary colours. A 6-bit depth can display 2^6 different shades between darkest and lightest colour, and an 8-bit screen can display 2^8 shades.

2^6 is 64 steps, therefore 64 steps for each primary colour is 64*64*64, equals 262,144 displayable colours. A lot of laptop screens claim this number.

An 8-bit screen can display 2^8 or 256 steps from darkest to lightest, so its displayable colours is 256*256*256, equals 16,277,216, usually rounded to 17 million colours. (note that .jpg images are always 8-bit images.)

A top-of-the-line monitor like the Eizo range can display 2^10 steps darkest to lightest, which gives 1024 steps, and a huge total range of over a billion colours.

Two more comments. I would be very surprised if your Samsung has 32-bit colour. That sounds like marketing hype to me. Also, resolution has nothing to do with bit depth and everything to do with pixel count. 1920x1080 seems to be the current standard for desktop monitors and a few 17-inch lappys. My 15-inch laptop is 1680x1050 and isnt too bad for a 6-bit device.

Sorry for the novel,

Colin

[goddi]

...Two more comments. I would be very surprised if your Samsung has 32-bit colour. That sounds like marketing hype to me. Also, resolution has nothing to do with bit depth and everything to do with pixel count. 1920x1080 seems to be the current standard for desktop monitors and a few 17-inch lappys. My 15-inch laptop is 1680x1050 and isnt too bad for a 6-bit device.

Sorry for the novel,

Colin

=====================

Colin,

Thanks for the info. But I can not get any more specs on this laptop from anyone. Still trying but it just can not be found...yet. All I can find is that it is "1920x1080, FHD TruBrite TFT LED Backlit Display, 16:9, Supports 1080p content".

When I look at my Nvidia info of my Samsung monitor, it shows that the Color Depth is 32-bit. Take a look at the attach screenshot. Are we talking about the same thing?

Gary

[goddi]

...Two more comments. I would be very surprised if your Samsung has 32-bit colour. That sounds like marketing hype to me. Also, resolution has nothing to do with bit depth and everything to do with pixel count. 1920x1080 seems to be the current standard for desktop monitors and a few 17-inch lappys. My 15-inch laptop is 1680x1050 and isnt too bad for a 6-bit device.

Sorry for the novel,

Colin

=======================

Colin,

I finally got some answers. I got a number for Toshiba's Customer Service Sales (whoever they are?) but I was told that the screen for the Qosmio X70 is a 6-bit TN. Each time I asked a question, he had to put me on hold and go ask someone. So I don't know what else to think. Perhaps all laptops are like this but it has become too much of a burden to dig into the detail. Not sure yet what I will do. It does seem to have a good graphics card, though. But it looks like it is a good laptop to output to an external monitor as mentioned, after doing all the detailed work on a desktop PC. Thanks for the info.

Gary

[cjdnzl]

=====================

Colin,

Thanks for the info. But I can not get any more specs on this laptop from anyone. Still trying but it just can not be found...yet. All I can find is that it is "1920x1080, FHD TruBrite TFT LED Backlit Display, 16:9, Supports 1080p content".

When I look at my Nvidia info of my Samsung monitor, it shows that the Color Depth is 32-bit. Take a look at the attach screenshot. Are we talking about the same thing?

Gary

Aha. Yes, your nVidia driver software can deliver 32-bit colour depth, but that is not your monitor depth. I just looked at this laptop with its 6-bit screen, and the nVidia driver is set to 32-bit (this lappy has a dedicated nVidia Geforce 8600M-GT graphics chip, which is why I bought it). According to the relevant literature, the screen dithers the colours it cannot directly produce. I guess the marketers do not want to admit limitations in their product, so they hide things like TN and 6-bit screens, which puts you in the 'awkward customer' category, wanting to know these things. I guess it's only those who deal with graphics who worry about it, others are just happy with a coloured screen

Regards,

Colin

[goddi]

Aha. Yes, your nVidia driver software can deliver 32-bit colour depth, but that is not your monitor depth. I just looked at this laptop with its 6-bit screen, and the nVidia driver is set to 32-bit (this lappy has a dedicated nVidia Geforce 8600M-GT graphics chip, which is why I bought it). According to the relevant literature, the screen dithers the colours it cannot directly produce. I guess the marketers do not want to admit limitations in their product, so they hide things like TN and 6-bit screens, which puts you in the 'awkward customer' category, wanting to know these things. I guess it's only those who deal with graphics who worry about it, others are just happy with a coloured screen

Regards,

Colin

===============================

This has been an interesting and educational event. It looks like they put a high-powered engine with a govenor on the throttle in the laptops. The TN and 6-bit screens are OK for gamers but not for working with images. I understand now why they don't want to publish these specs. :(/>

Thanks.

Gary

[cjdnzl]

===============================

This has been an interesting and educational event. It looks like they put a high-powered engine with a govenor on the throttle in the laptops. The TN and 6-bit screens are OK for gamers but not for working with images. I understand now why they don't want to publish these specs. :(/>/>

Thanks.

Gary

Hello again Gary,

I forgot to explain why the choices are 16-bit or 32-bit in your video driver. In actual fact images with 8-bit depth are actually 8 bits per primary colour, so the total for 3 colours is 24 bits, or three bytes. But because Windows works in 32-bit which is four bytes at a time, it uses a dummy byte so it can work with 3-byte variables, a sort of padding to suit the 32-bit environment. The image is still only 3 bytes or 24 bits, the extra byte is just ignored.

In 16-bit mode, the colour depth is reduced to 4 bits per colour, 12 bits of information, and the remaining 4 bits are padded to make 2 bytes.

The same happens in your camera. My Canon uses 14 bits of data in RAW mode, but is padded out to 16 bits for the cpu, and again the last 2 bits are ignored.

That's my 2 bit's worth.