Eagle-Condor Presentation

[LumenLux]

On Beechbrook, Bill has posted a link to my presentation "Eagle-Condor". But I am unable to download it from Beechbrook. I either get an error message, or a new web page which shows my PTE show's correct path in the URL box. If I copy that show path from the URL box, and send that address in an email - I can in the received email, right click, and "save target as" - then the file will download and run just fine!? This is my first attempt at using Beechbrook site for a link instead of the actual show file. I sure hope someone can explain what is wrong.

I am posting this same link here, to see if you'all have the same results from Beechbrook vs. this direct link: Eagle-Condor.zip

(Editing here: I think Beechbrook is now working and the direct link is not. The presentation is also available here: http://pte.do-some-good.com **Second edit: Now Hawk's sharp eye spotted the problem, so all links now seem to work , thank you.)

If some of you successfully download the show, I would really like your comments and suggestions. I have already used the presentation for it's initial purpose. I know, that like most my efforts, "I could have done better with more time." Since the "premier" of the show, an expanded use for the presentation has developed. I would really like to try to improve the show. Relating this to some recent forum discussion, I think this would be a good chance to see what kind of useful discussion might develop. Of course I have some apologies or excuses ready, but I hope this might be an opportunity for some forum members who never comment, to join in. The show is about 35mb and runs 12 1/2 minutes.

[Hawk]

Hi Robert

The link from Beechbrook worked for me, downloaded no problem.

Your other direct link " Eagle-Condor.zip " is not - " File not found " it appears you have - /PTE%2520shows/EagleCondor.zip

If the 25 is removed from "2520" - as to read

"http://lumenlux.do-some-good.com/PTE%20shows/EagleCondor.zip"

Then all is well.

[LumenLux]

Thank you Ralph, I edited the link and it does now download properly. Other than just having the sharp eye of a Hawk, how does one know that those numbers in the link were extraneous? Thinking I had simply pasted the link, how would it have the extra characters?

[Rooskidiver]

Hi Lumenlux,

I had no trouble downloading your show from the Cottage.

[i would really like your comments and suggestions.]

Well since you asked ... Actually the show was quite good and gives an important message. The narration was timed well with the slides and there were some really good pictures of the people and countrysides.

I had a little trouble with the speed of the transitions though ... as in not enough time to look at some of the photos. I can't see you correcting this however without removing some of the pictures. It would probably be better to change some of the effects. More fade in/outs, gates, and page effects. Less hour hands and circular effects. I don't know if you set the effects for each individual slide or let PTE randomly pick the effect, but for me it would have been easier to view if you had stuck to maybe five or six different kinds of effects.

This is of course just my opinion. Like I said ... overall the show was very well put together. The message is what's really important. I buy children's books on Ebay and at garage sales all the time and send to a small school in Fiji that desperately need them. A little giving of ourselves can make a huge difference to those in need.

Thanks for posting the show.

Carol

[LumenLux]

I can't see you correcting this however without removing some of the pictures. It would probably be better to change some of the effects. More fade in/outs, gates, and page effects. Less hour hands and circular effects. I don't know if you set the effects for each individual slide or let PTE randomly pick the effect, but for me it would have been easier to view if you had stuck to maybe five or six different kinds of effects.

Thank you Carol.

I may be able to remove some slides if I can do it without throwing the sound/photo relationship. Some of the photos were actually hastily chosen fillers for the fixed narration time. I like your idea of replacing some of the transitions with ones that might seem less hurried. I too don't like that many different transitions. Pressed as I was for time, I had only customized the transitions for the first few slides and the last few. I guess the bulk of the transitions then vary everytime the show is viewed? I need to verify that.

While you have me in a "confessing" mood, I think of many other compromises I made in the presentation. But I shall wait to see if other viewers bring them into discussion. Thanks again for your input here and for the very good shows you share.

[Rooskidiver]

Hi Lumenlux,

I would hesitate if it were me to try removing any slides. That sounds like a lot of work to redo the sound/photo relationship. And each slide contributes to the story. I would be more inclined to adjust the effects for individual slides. I don't think the transitions vary everytime the show is viewed but I could be wrong. I do think that if you don't individually set the effect for a grouping of slides, PTE uses all the different effects that are checked under Project Options. Perhaps you could just uncheck the ones you don't want to be randomly used by PTE and preview the results. Might save you some time. Then if there are a couple of slides that you want to use a different effect, set their effects under Customize Slides.

[i think of many other compromises I made in the presentation.]

Yes, this can happen if you're on a deadline. I always look back at my programs and think I could have changed this or that. And I'm never on a deadline. But as with many things, it's a learning process. PTE keeps changing and improving and I think we will all need to improve and change with it!

Carol

[d67]

Hi Lumenlux,

I too had no problem downloading your show from Cottage.

You slideshow is very interesting.

Although I didn't understand all that was said, I clearly understood the message you wanted to give us only with your photos.

You find the explanation to this at the bottom of my post. (I had no problem with Al Robinson's PTE 101 tutorial because he spoked slowly).

I too had a little trouble with the speed of the transitions and the numerous variety of effects is a litle bit disturbing.

Concerning the number of photos, perhaps it is not necessary to reduce it if you use more small photos ; 1 or 2 small photos showed together in a normal slide as background).

I find your pictures also a litle bit smooth. Perhaps enhencing the colors/contrast and sharpness makes more effect ?

It's just my opinion and once more I found your slideshow very interesting.

Thank you very much for sharing your work with the internet community and, sorry for my poor english.

Patrick

Strasbourg, France

[LumenLux]

Thank you Patrick for your very good observations and ideas.

You slideshow is very interesting.

Although I didn't understand all that was said, I clearly understood the message you wanted to give us only with your photos.

Sometimes this is the most important thing. But all other "problems" can detract from any show's intended message.

Concerning the number of photos, perhaps it is not necessary to reduce it if you use more small photos ; 1 or 2 small photos showed together in a normal slide as background).

Interesting idea, I may work with this while leaving sound track intact.

I find your pictures also a litle bit smooth. Perhaps enhencing the colors/contrast and sharpness makes more effect ?

This is my own biggest displeasure with this show. Many of the photos are my own, both digital and earlier film. Many of the photos are not mine and frankly are in some ways not very good photographically. But they are real and in a few cases, I think the roughness of the photo may actually add to the effect of the message? I guess I now decide if it is justified to refine some of the photos. I also thought of resizing for consistency, but decided "no" at the time.

Thank you very much for sharing your work with the internet community and, sorry for my poor english.

This is never a problem. When you and other non-english members "speak" here, I love it. I just wish I could "hear" the french accent! I've been reading "guru" long enough that I think I can hear his accent.

[Hawk]

Lumenlux

Thank you very much for sharing this show with us all. Shows of this nature are needed more of, and a well educated outlook of what goes on in the world around us. The messages express itself very clearly and nicely narrated. I enjoyed your fine collection of photos. As PTE users we can well appreciate the time and effort to putting together a well done show as you have done.

Comments

As far as any editing I feel there is very little required. With the pictures and narration you had to work with and keeping the show in sequence there are limitations as to timing of photos to a narrated show.

After watching 4 times I can see why the need for faster show / short transitions as to keep up with the narration which you have exceptionally timed. As the narration mentioned names and photos to match, this must have been a chore.

You have enlightened me as to narrating a show. Were speed of speech, topic and pauses play an important part.

If the narration would have been different then I would have to also agree with longer show / slower transitions maybe a little music to break up the narration – but this is not the case here.

Due to the speed of the show the only suggestion I can pass along is maybe a slide or two near the end with thumbnail photos of the persons mentioned in the narration.

Cutting back on the amount of different transitions may keep the concentration on show rather than eyes following the transitions.

I did have a problem with about 5 slides repeating ? – Not sure if this was intended or it may have been my computer.

I thing asking for comments on ones shows is a great discussion topic as we all can learn.

Thanks for asking. – Just an opinion from a NO PRO user.

Looking forward to more opinions.

Best wishes to you and the folks associated with the show – much appreciated.

[verhoef]

Hi Lumenlux,

I had no problem in downloading and playing it from beechbrook.

You wanted some comment; well I will keep it short:

-This is a good example of a documentary show.

- The transitions are fast; but because the underlying music is in fact spoken this does not have to be the problem itself, but..

- With the fast transitions people may become quickly tired, because of the constant adaptation of eyes and brains. (it is not like in a film where the images are all linked in a streaming transition).

- There are indeed too many different transition methods used.

- When listening to the spoken words I feel distracted in viewing the pictures and vice versa (English is not my native language)

- There are quite a lot of unsharp pictures (especially in the beginning), maybe you should leave them out or mask them with an applied software filter.

But, the overall idea is good and your statement really comes out!!!

greetings

Michel Verhoef.

[ContaxMan]

Downloaded from Beechbrook with no problems at all. My only criticism is that I found the mixed slide transitions distracting. Would prefer dissolve for most with maybe one other used to indicate something special/different - e.g. a change of topic. The narration & music worked very well & the message came over loud & clear.

[verhoef]

Hi Lumenlux,

It would be nice to see what someone does, or does not, with comments placed by other members. Will you upload a revised version of this show on Beechbrook ? I think that would be very nice to compare.

Michel Verhoef

[LumenLux]

It's gratifying to get so much response. And it is very helpful. Thanks everyone, and I still welcome others observations and opinions.

Clearly there are some aspects apparent to several viewers and a few individual differences. I think it interesting also the insight of other users into the inherent constraints of the project.

Continuing with response to responses - (Hawk & Michel & ContaxMan)

If the narration would have been different then I would have to also agree with longer show / slower transitions maybe a little music to break up the narration – but this is not the case here.

You understand my challenge on this one. I was given the parameters that the show should be about 12 minutes. The narration was voiced nicely into about 10 wav files. On each spotlighted person or activity, I was given maybe 3 -10 photos. Then I had to use my own photos to fit with the others and pace the photos to the 10 wav segments of varying length. It was indeed fun - and a little tricky to combine. Frankly, it came together better and in less time than I expected.

I did have a problem with about 5 slides repeating ? – Not sure if this was intended or it may have been my computer.

I have not experienced this - even on the 750 mhz pc I composed it on. If you could stand to watch it again and describe a slide or two where it repeats, I could see if the transitions are too close on the time line. (This may be too much to ask of you. I was impressed that you had already watched the presentation 4 times. That is dedication when you don't have a vested interest in the subject matter.)

With the fast transitions people may become quickly tired, because of the constant adaptation of eyes and brains. (it is not like in a film where the images are all linked in a streaming transition).

Thanks for this thought. I have never considered brain/eye exercise might be a factor of tiring the viewer- but I am sure you are right, that it could be. Usually, if it is a casual audience, not specifically analyzing the presentation or the photography, I fear more they will fall asleep from a slow pace than from the brain/eye exercise. But this maybe a specifically North American problem.

Would prefer dissolve for most with maybe one other used to indicate something special/different - e.g. a change of topic.

Yes, and related to an earlier comment, the random transitions are indeed different each time the .exe file is run. So I think a given run of the show may be more objectionable or pleasant than a different time. This is all the more reason that in many cases every transition should be selected rather than random. Then again, hand choosing 200 transition effects may be not "worth it" to the show creator. But if we realize what a difference it can make, then we can make a better decision on whether it is "worth it."

And now Michel - as you say - It would be nice to see what someone does, or does not, with comments placed by other members. Will you upload a revised version of this show on Beechbrook ? I think that would be very nice to compare.

I agree, a very good idea. Right now, I do not know what changes I will make in this presentation. There are indeed future audiences scheduled that could see a better, maybe more effective presentation, if I make some changes. However, I need to weigh my limited time resource to determine which changes are the best value for effort ratio. It may be that much of the good discussion and ideas won't end up in this show. But the thoughts that have been brought out will definitely be constructive on future projects. If I do remodel the Eagle-Condor presentation significantly, I will post the revision.

Oh, one more thought here. What do any of you think of using the navigation bar to control the presentation. In this case, the initial showing of the presentation was to a rather large audience, and there was no desire on my part to stop the show during it's 12 minute allowed time. But for many future viewers, watching it on their own PC, do you think the nav bar, allowing to pause etc, would be a partial solution to the maybe-too-rapid pace?

[verhoef]

Hi Lumenlux

Oh, one more thought here. What do any of you think of using the navigation bar to control the presentation. In this case, the initial showing of the presentation was to a rather large audience, and there was no desire on my part to stop the show during it's 12 minute allowed time. But for many future viewers, watching it on their own PC, do you think the nav bar, allowing to pause etc, would be a partial solution to the maybe-too-rapid pace?

I think that if there is a navigation bar, than people will use it, so they will skip to another part of the show and consequently miss some slides. This breaks up a show (including the music).. so I think only use a navigation bar if there are really different subjects to skip to.

Another remark to the 'eye-brain' concentration. You might compare this effect to the 'old fashioned' slide presentation with one projector. In between the slides you got the black-outs in the skippng to the next slide. This also makes people very, very tired. That was for me the first reason (some years ago) for buying a second projector and have the possibility of fading the slides. But now of course we have these tremendous digital possibilities, making the projectors standing workless in the attic.

greetings

Michel Verhoef

[ralvis]

I think that if there is a navigation bar, than people will use it, so they will skip to another part of the show and consequently miss some slides. This breaks up a show (including the music).. so I think only use a navigation bar if there are really different subjects to skip to.

If I am watching a timed show and it is not holding my interest I will most likely exit the show.

If there is a nav bar I will most likely proceed throught the show to the end.

There is a way to utilize both the timed and nav methods.

I am able to do this in Flash by starting the show as a timed show and when

I click the timed button it will stop the show and I have the back forwd buttons

to nav the show. The music will continue to play in the background without restarting.

Ralvis

[Ken Cox]

If I am watching a timed show and it is not holding my interest I will most likely exit the show.

Ralvis

you got my vote on that statement

I have yet to see the reason for syncing a non speaking show -- the ordinary sync feature has satisfied me

but then i have not the smarts to set up a synced show so maybe i am biased -- i dont need the hassle -- my body cant take the stress

ken

[ralvis]

Good Evening

Here is the concept I would like to be able to use with PTE.

I show this example in Flash to give Igor an idea of how it is done.

This is just a short demo with 6 images and 30 seconds of audio.

You will notice a row on control buttons. The center

button is the key button. The show comes up running

in a timed mode and will, by my choice loop continually.

If you choose to take control of the show you click the

center button and the show will stop. The button has

the universal image for pause and start. You may

then manually go forward of backwards through the

show. To start the auto mode again just click the pause

start key (center key)

I have asked many computer users what they prefer and they

all like being able to control the show if they desire to.

We as Slideshow designers need to look at what the audience

wants as well as what we prefer.

This control method keeps both camps happy.

Anyway here is a link to that example.

Cheers Ralvis

GiveUsersControl

[alrobin]

Ralvis,

I like your simple nav bar - I think it is more attractive than the present one in PTE, too.

Maybe an added feature would be the ability to hide it if so desired by the viewer. Also, we should still retain the option for the show maker to exclude it if he or she prefers not to use it.

[ContaxMan]

Yes - it's certainly very clear and attractive. But it would be important to have the option not to show it - for the user as well as the programmer.

[Hawk]

Lumenlux

In reply to:

Oh, one more thought here. What do any of you think of using the navigation bar to control the presentation.

I would have to personally say NO – not at this time. I think the navigation bar would only interfere with the flow of narration.

-------------------------

In regards to your changing show for PC users.

I am also a firm believer in user control especially on large shows and without a navigation bar an option would be to set the show up as a “ MENU SHOW “.

One of the great new features of PTE was the added “ Run external application “ giving the user the choice to split large shows into separate smaller shows, also giving the viewer an option of what sections to watch.

Library / Earthquake Rebuilding / Help of the youth / Bicycle Trip – etc.

If I were to view a large 150 slide show and found it not interesting between slides 40 – 60, I likely would shut it down and unfortunately miss the best part

A Menu Show can allow the user to run the full show if chooses to do so.

Or

If one chose to view one of the smaller shows and found it not of interest then they have the option to view another section from the menu, therefore not missing the entire show or possible the best part which may be of great interest to the viewer.