Monitor profile problem?

[alandrabble]

Hi,

I'm new to this forum, but have been using PTE for several years. v5 seems to have introduced a bug - I have found one similar thread, but it trailed off-topic.

PTE seems to ignore or disable the monitor's ICC profile when you click Preview or run the .exe file. There is a noticeable colour shift and the monitor gets brighter. The point is, PTE v4.48 works correctly, but v5.03 doesn't. All other applications are fine - PS Elements, MS Expression Media, Audacity, Firefox, PhotoZoom, DXO Optics Pro and others all work correctly. So, I cannot see how this problem can be down to hardware or drivers. Also, a project created with v4.48 doesn't have a problem, but if I open the .pte file in v5.03 and re-create the .exe I then get the same problem.

Has this been fixed in 5.1?

FYI, I am running XP, the graphics card is a Radeon 9200 driving a iiyama monitor via DVI.

Alan

[xahu34]

Hello,

I have the same problem with my own old PC. From WnSoft I obtained an explanation of the following kind: PTE v.5 uses a certain mode of DirectX (usually used by PC games) and relies on the correctness of the driver software. But in this particular mode the ATI drivers are said to ignore color profiles. Sorry to say, but possible solutions read as follows (any of them is said to work):

1. Deactivate D3D in PTE (pan, zoom, rotate will no longer work correctly)

2. Buy an nvidia graphics card

3. Change to Windows Vista

My new PC (still running with XP) has an nvidia card and works perfectly.

Kind regards,

xahu34

Munich

[alandrabble]

Thanks for your help. I've just tried deactivating D3D, and the problem disappears. But it also affects the quality of fades, IMO. The other options aren't attractive either. Looks like I'll stick with v4.48 for the foreseeable future.

Alan

[Igor]

There are good news. After reading of your message today I've experimented again with ATI settings and fullscreen mode and probably I will able to cure this ATI problem. I better understand now how ATI damages gamma settings and I can restore damaged gamma for fullscreen mode of slideshow. If my testing during next a couple of days confirms success, I'll publish the public beta for more wide testing.

This problem happens only under Windows XP on ATI video cards with fullscreen slideshows (hardware accelleration). It is definitely an ATI bug.

Please visit this topic next days to download special beta version later.

[speedskater]

After reading of your message today I've experimented again with ATI settings and fullscreen mode and probably I will able to cure this ATI problem. I better understand now how ATI damages gamma settings and I can restore damaged gamma for fullscreen mode of slideshow.

Hi Igor,

I am using a Pantone huey for monitor calibration. I have found out that the huey software overcomes the ATI problem.

After starting the slideshow my ATI Radeon graphics card disregards the monitor profile. As soon as the huey starts its room light monitoring the profile is back and my monitor shows the right colors again.

So the huey software can restore the monitor profile in fullscreen mode. Maybe you can find out how it works and implement a comparable solution in PTE. Hope my information helps a little.

Markus

[Igor]

Markus,

Yes, exactly! We can save gamma settings before activating of the fullscreen mode and when ATI drivers corrupted it, load gamma profile back. The task a little complicated by a fact that ATI additionally suggests alternate desktop gamma settings and fullscreen gamma settings in ATI control panel. We have to correctly handle all these combinations of color settings.

Please test special beta when I publish me, it is important to test how it will work with Pantone software.

[xahu34]

Hello admin1,

maybe you know that the German AV-software "m.objects" (a very nice program with features beyond the amateur's requirements, but at about 15 times the price of PTE) has actually manged the ATI problem for quite a long time (same situation with Wings Platinum (~900 Euro) as far as I know).

If you will be able to solve the problem, as well, this will be a significant step forward with respect to the acceptance of your product!

Kind regards,

xahu34

Munich

[Guest Dick Le Bleu]

I'm glad to see this fix happening. I've been struggling with an old ATI All in Wonder 7500, and thought I would just have to live with it until I replaced the computer. I look forward to the next beta to see if this issue can be solved!

Dick

[Igor]

xahu34,

Probably these products don't use exclusive fullscreen mode, just a simulated fullscreen as we used in old version 4.48?

[mhwarner]

Hi Igor,

I use ColorVision Spyder to calibrate my monitor (with ATI Mobility Radeon X1400 graphics) card. I would love to help you beta test to see if you can resolve this problem which ATI apparently can't be bothered to work on.

[AnKo]

Hi Igor,

Yes! If you could make that work ....! And also I use ColorVision Spyder2 to calibrate my monitor (with ASUS Radeon 9800 XT 256 Mb graphics) card. And I sure would love to help you beta test too.

André

[Igor]

We prepared internal version of PicturesToExe which should fix this problem with gamma on ATI video cards. I publish EXE file of slideshow which should has same gamma as on desktop.

Also you'll find inside source files of this slideshow and you can compare images and create this EXE file in current version of PicturesToExe where problem with gamma exists.

http://www.wnsoft.com/test/ATIGammaTest.zip (1 MB)

If all will be fine, we'll publish beta version of PicturesToExe with this fix.

I will very grateful for your responses.

[speedskater]

We prepared internal version of PicturesToExe which should fix this problem with gamma on ATI video cards. I publish EXE file of slideshow which should has same gamma as on desktop.

Also you'll find inside source files of this slideshow and you can compare images and create this EXE file in current version of PicturesToExe where problem with gamma exists.

Looks good so far. I can't notice any gamma shifts with the published exe. Now I'm waiting for the new beta to test it with my own slideshows.

Thank you very much for your good work, Igor!

Markus

[Guest Dick Le Bleu]

ATI All in Wonder Radeon 7500.

Works fine! No change in profile!

I also use Pantone Huey to calibrate my LG L1910B monitor. It warms the image a bit from the default settings. All slideshows created to date appear to pause a bit at the beginning while the screen cools a bit before the show begins and the Huey profile is overwritten. Your testfix file did not do that!

To make sure, I used your source images, and created a slideshow. The profile change was visible again.

So it looks like you may have it licked!

Dick

[keith@elnor.org.uk]

Test works fine on my ATI Radeon X 1300PRO. Monitor was profiled using Spyder2.

I look forward to the fixed Beta.

[AnKo]

Hi Igor,

Test works perfect here too with my Asus Radeon 9800 XT 256 Mb card. Can't wait for the next update of PtE!!

Thanks for your very quick respons on this subject (as on all, by the way).

André

[alrobin]

Igor,

Your example displays in exactly the same way in either PTE v 5.0 or 5.1, beta 10. If I set a new Gamma profile, PTE cancels it in both versions of the program, in the same way as it always has, and then returns it after I exit from the show.

I'm using an ATI Radeon 9600 "All in Wonder" video card.

The effect can be demonstrated readily by clicking on "alt-tab" after the show has started. The gamma settings are restored until one clicks on the screen to start the show again, both in version 5.0 and 5.1.

[Guest Techman1]

Igor,

When I run your test, there is a quick color shift and then it appears that the profile goes back to the way it is suppose to look on my system. Normally, I see the color shift and it stays until the slideshow is complete and then resets back to the profiled look. So, it looks like you are starting the show and immediately shifting the profile back to the calibrated profile. So, if this were implemented it would be much more acceptable then the current state.

My system is Running Windows XP Pro, All-In-Wonder 9600 Series and my Calibration System is the Display Eye-One by Gretag Macbeth.

Thanks for working on this for us!

Regards,

Fred

[Guest Techman1]

Al,

Did you run Igor's test EXE slideshow? That is the version that has the correction in it, I believe! It looks like it is working by shifting the calibration profile back as the first step in the slideshow.

Fred

[alrobin]

Fred,

Yes, I should have mentioned that I also tested using Igor's example exe file. Below are screen-shots, with my digital camera set on manual, of the image he provided (first image), versus it's appearance in the show (second image).

The images are purposely blurred to eliminate the Moire patterns. And I chose a gamma correction for the test that was noticeably different from the Adobe RGB setting I use normally.

[Igor]

Thanks for testing!

That all what I can do with bug in ATI drivers.

Al,

Please run Test_ATI_gamma_fix.exe and press Win button on the keyboard. Do you see shift in colors? Then click left mouse button on a slide (it will switch back to exclusive fullscreen mode).

In slideshows created with v5.1 Beta or earlier you could see color shift when you pressed Win button. Now with test slideshow Test_ATI_gamma_fix.exe no shift should occur on ATI video card with calibrated display.

Fred,

When I run your test, there is a quick color shift and then it appears that the profile goes back to the way it is suppose to look on my system

You can solve even this problem if you set to default colors in ATI Control panel (for both modes - Desktop and Fullscreen applications) and restart Windows.

[mhwarner]

Igor, I think you've got it! I use ColorVision Spyder to calibrate my monitor (with ATI Mobility Radeon X1400 graphics) card. I first created a show with the 2 files in your Test.pte and beta 10. There was still a gamma shift which I could turn off and on by using Alt-Tab or the Windows key. Then I ran your Test_FixForATIbug.exe file and there was no shift at all, no matter what I tried. Great work!

One thing I did notice, which may or may not be a bug. I see that you set the slides to "Wait for a key press or mouse click to show next slide". The only key that works to advance the slides on my computer is the right mouse button. Is that the way it's supposed to work?

[Igor]

Mary,

One thing I did notice, which may or may not be a bug. I see that you set the slides to "Wait for a key press or mouse click to show next slide". The only key that works to advance the slides on my computer is the right mouse button. Is that the way it's supposed to work?

Yes, I adjusted manual advance mode and right mouse key for a next slide in this slideshow.

[alandrabble]

Igor,

Thank you very much for all your help with this. I can confirm you've fixed it, at least as it appears to my eye.

Radeon 9200 card and ICC profile created with Spyder 2.

Alan

[alrobin]

Igor,

I still see the shift when I press the "Windows" key, and it reverts back when I click on the slide.

My Gamma setting is a brightness setting rather than a colour shift. I set it up in "Control Panel / Adobe Gamma", and saved it there as an "icc" profile. However, it should behave the same as a colour adjustment.